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High birthrate=increased poverty
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Gaius Mucius Scaevola Sinistra
Japher: "crap, did I just post in this thread?"
"Bloody hell, Lefty.....number one in my list of persons I have no intention of annoying, ever." Bugs ****ing Bunny
From a 6th grader who readily adpated to internet culture: "Pay attention now, because your opinions suck" -
Lefty is also from Texas you know.Comment
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OTOH, It took Nixon to go to China, and Begin was the one to sign a peace treaty with Egypt. Sharon might be able to produce or initiate a viable solution. And, IIRC, it was Sharon who convinced Begin to remove the settlements in the Sinai and criticized Shamir for not opposing efforts towards a peace initiative with Jordan.Originally posted by Sirotnikov
People don't vote for Sharon to make the peace deal. They vote for him to fight a war against terror. When there will be a time for peace, the Israeli public will vote for a Labour candidate. Just like it happenned in 1999."I read a book twice as fast as anybody else. First, I read the beginning, and then I read the ending, and then I start in the middle and read toward whatever end I like best." - Gracie AllenComment
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" Surveys done in Israel continually show that around 80% believe that a palestinian state will eventually be set up, and around 50% are willing for it to be more or less in the 1967 borders."
Well, then, what are we waiting for? Hop to it!
Fact is, the Palestinians have you over a human rights barrell on the right of return for refugees. The result will be a dismantling of all settlements in the West Bank in addition to ~100% of the '67 borders, a Jerusalem dual capital and some sort of compensatory damages (water rights?). Also, Palestine will be unable to guarantee Israeli security from the likes of Hezbollah. Everybody OK with that? Good! Sign right here...
"It's not a secret that super high birthrates all keep third world countries in poverty."
Super high birthrates don't keep anybody in poverty. Sustained bad governmental policies keep people in poverty. And since Israel is occupying the West Bank, it's responsible for the area.I came upon a barroom full of bad Salon pictures in which men with hats on the backs of their heads were wolfing food from a counter. It was the institution of the "free lunch" I had struck. You paid for a drink and got as much as you wanted to eat. For something less than a rupee a day a man can feed himself sumptuously in San Francisco, even though he be a bankrupt. Remember this if ever you are stranded in these parts. ~ Rudyard Kipling, 1891Comment
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What does what have to do with Sharons offer? the Clinton proposal? I'm merely saying that the end result will probably be closer to that offer than this one. And that perhaps the next time the Palestinians have an offer, they offer a counter proposal, instead of initiating an intifada....Originally posted by DanS
Edan: What does that have to do with Sharon's offer of a mere 40% of the West Bank and the creation of a non-state state? Truly, you confuse me."I read a book twice as fast as anybody else. First, I read the beginning, and then I read the ending, and then I start in the middle and read toward whatever end I like best." - Gracie AllenComment
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An end to the terrorism?Originally posted by DanS
Well, then, what are we waiting for?
Before the Intifada, it is the PA who were maintaining the government policies for nearly all the Palestinians for a number of years, and even then, it wasn't until April that Israel started it's massive incursions.Super high birthrates don't keep anybody in poverty. Sustained bad governmental policies keep people in poverty. And since Israel is occupying the West Bank, it's responsible for the area.
(And what about Gaza? Gaza is worse off than the West Bank and, AFAIK, there's been very little in the way of incursions there.Last edited by Edan; December 5, 2002, 22:52."I read a book twice as fast as anybody else. First, I read the beginning, and then I read the ending, and then I start in the middle and read toward whatever end I like best." - Gracie AllenComment
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Edan: Arafat must have believed that splitting the difference between what he was offering and what Israel was offering would be unacceptable. There is no shame in them recognizing reality and walking away from the table.
Edit: The intifada is a noble cause. Just the tactics used in pursuit of the cause are ignoble.I came upon a barroom full of bad Salon pictures in which men with hats on the backs of their heads were wolfing food from a counter. It was the institution of the "free lunch" I had struck. You paid for a drink and got as much as you wanted to eat. For something less than a rupee a day a man can feed himself sumptuously in San Francisco, even though he be a bankrupt. Remember this if ever you are stranded in these parts. ~ Rudyard Kipling, 1891Comment
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What a lame excuse. He knew in 1993 that he would have to make some (painful) choices and compromises, that in the end he wasn't willing to make because he's a terrorist who refuses to change his stripes.Originally posted by DanS
Edan: Arafat must have believed that splitting the difference between what he was offering and what Israel was offering would be unacceptable. There is no shame in them recognizing reality and walking away from the table.
Perhaps Israel should realize that the Palestinian Leadership will never be able to live in a Palestinian State in peace with Israel (as aposed to instead of Israel), and walk away from peace with the Palestinians, and start there own intifada against the Palestinians by trying to kill as many civilians as they can?
"I read a book twice as fast as anybody else. First, I read the beginning, and then I read the ending, and then I start in the middle and read toward whatever end I like best." - Gracie AllenComment
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An US leased F16 intifada. How high tech.
If Israel does that I doubt that there will be any Israel to speak of.
The world is connected. You can't even attack Iraq without its concent let alone Israel try to ethnic cleanse Palestine.
DO try and be real.Comment
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" What a lame excuse. He knew in 1993 that he would have to make some (painful) choices and compromises, that in the end he wasn't willing to make because he's a terrorist who refuses to change his stripes."
No, not a lame excuse at all. When there's no basis for further negotiation, you are obliged to walk away from the table. To do otherwise would be giving out false information about your intentions and endanger the possibility of an acceptable deal.I came upon a barroom full of bad Salon pictures in which men with hats on the backs of their heads were wolfing food from a counter. It was the institution of the "free lunch" I had struck. You paid for a drink and got as much as you wanted to eat. For something less than a rupee a day a man can feed himself sumptuously in San Francisco, even though he be a bankrupt. Remember this if ever you are stranded in these parts. ~ Rudyard Kipling, 1891Comment
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Someone doesn't understand Sarcasm. Note the rolling eyes icon."I read a book twice as fast as anybody else. First, I read the beginning, and then I read the ending, and then I start in the middle and read toward whatever end I like best." - Gracie AllenComment
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Yeah, keep repeating to yourself that Arafat was serious about peace, diplomacy and negotiating and exausted all non-violent ways of getting a Palestinian state. Maybe if one says it enough times, one can believe it.No, not a lame excuse at all. When there's no basis for further negotiation, you are obliged to walk away from the table. To do otherwise would be giving out false information about your intentions and endanger the possibility of an acceptable deal.
"I read a book twice as fast as anybody else. First, I read the beginning, and then I read the ending, and then I start in the middle and read toward whatever end I like best." - Gracie AllenComment
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I have no basis to think that he wasn't serious about these things. Failed negotiations doesn't indicate bad intentions on anybody's part.I came upon a barroom full of bad Salon pictures in which men with hats on the backs of their heads were wolfing food from a counter. It was the institution of the "free lunch" I had struck. You paid for a drink and got as much as you wanted to eat. For something less than a rupee a day a man can feed himself sumptuously in San Francisco, even though he be a bankrupt. Remember this if ever you are stranded in these parts. ~ Rudyard Kipling, 1891Comment
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"I hear there's always a fine piece of journalism on the 3rd page."
I don't know how they get away with it. That would be frowned on quite a bit here in the States.
I came upon a barroom full of bad Salon pictures in which men with hats on the backs of their heads were wolfing food from a counter. It was the institution of the "free lunch" I had struck. You paid for a drink and got as much as you wanted to eat. For something less than a rupee a day a man can feed himself sumptuously in San Francisco, even though he be a bankrupt. Remember this if ever you are stranded in these parts. ~ Rudyard Kipling, 1891Comment
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If Arafat was serious about the peace process (or even if he simply cared about the Palestinians):Originally posted by DanS
I have no basis to think that he wasn't serious about these things. Failed negotiations doesn't indicate bad intentions on anybody's part.
Why didn't he close down the weapons and bomb factories in the territories as was agreed to in the Oslo accords?
Why didn't he sieze the illegal weapons agreed to in the Oslo accords?
Why did he not close down Hamas, Islamic Jihad, Fatah, etc. and arrest it's leaders?
Why did he not prevent terrorist attacks?
Why were there more terrorist attacks in the 8 years after Oslo thean the Preceeding 8 years?
Why did Arafat embezzle aid to Palestinians?
Why are the textbooks published by the Palestinian Authority filled with hate and incitement?
Why should I believe that the man wasfor peace, when he refused to speak against the terrorism for more than a year and a half after the Intifada started, and only then after enourmous pressure?
Why should I trust Arafat? He tried to overthrow the governments of Jordan and Lebanon in the past, and I havent seen anything to make me think he's changed his ways."I read a book twice as fast as anybody else. First, I read the beginning, and then I read the ending, and then I start in the middle and read toward whatever end I like best." - Gracie AllenComment
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