Sweden Moves to Criminalize Religious Beliefs

[Monk]

Vesayen - you're right, that too has been the problem in Sweden, unlike Denmark and Norway which were occupied and therefore had the entire Nazi issued settled by 1945.

[Lincoln]

quote:

"They're going to include homosexuality in the category of hate speech."

Okay, what exactly does that mean in Sweden? How is "hate speech" defined and what is the penalty? And are you allowed to speak "hatefully" in your home, in public or at all?

[Clear Skies]

Why would you want to be able to speak hatefully anyway? Sod free speech - why should anyone be able to say anything offensive or hateful at all?

[Monk]

Okay, what exactly does that mean in Sweden? How is "hate speech" defined and what is the penalty? And are you allowed to speak "hatefully" in your home, in public or at all?

The overall point is that no matter what the article says, it won't be illegal just to oppose homosexuality. With regards to your question, there's no concrete border, of course, but note that my primary intent wasn't really to defend paragraphs. It was to demonstrate how embarrasing sites such as family.org manipulate and twist the truth to further their own agendas, and shouldn't be regarded trustworthy sources of information by you or anybody.

[Kropotkin]

I'm not an expert on laws but hate speech would probably be something like gross slander in public of the group. "Gays are sinfull, evil and the root to all problems in society and families." would propably come close. But don't take my word for it....

[Lincoln]

I don't rely on family.org for anything. That is why I am asking for Swedes or informed people on this to clarify what the reality is. And I have no desire to speak hatefully. The question is, what is the definition of "hate" in Sweden?

[DanS]

I know Denmark has a similar law, which IIRC was last enforced when a politician expressed his concern "The Muslims who come here are merely waiting until they're strong enough in numbers, before they take over the country and blahblahblah."

What's wrong with saying that? While I don't agree, why should it be against the law?

While we're at it, Neonazism should be legalized.

[Monk]

OK, I can tell you how the (rarely enforced) paragraph 266b in Danish penal code sounds, and given the similarity of Scandinavian legislation, one would think the Swedish one is approximately the same. My humble and quickly made translation:

"He who in public or with the intent of publishment in wider circles makes a statement which threatens or ridicules because of race, colour of skin, national or ethnic origns, faith or sexual preference is punished with a fine, a *** or max 2 years of prison."

*** = I don't know the English word. It's when they let you don't go to jail unless you repeat the offense or commit another.

[DanS]

I find that law to be a gross abridgement of freedom of speech.

[Lincoln]

Thanks Monk. I think the word is probation.

[Lincoln]

I think that we are learning the difference here between Europe and the United States.

[Monk]

I think that we are learning the difference here between Europe and the United States.

What do you think constitutes the difference? Given our new government, the paragraph won't last long, and it's used about once a year IIRC.

[Kitschum]

Originally posted by Lincoln
Okay, what exactly does that mean in Sweden? How is "hate speech" defined and what is the penalty? And are you allowed to speak "hatefully" in your home, in public or at all?

I won't debate this, but just to prevent some misconceptions.

Examples from an editorial on this. My translation and censoring the slurs (don't wanna look to lack tact ). Plus, see Monk's post on when these statements could be considered inflammatory.

"Tasso Stafilides, openly homosexual member of parliament for the Left Party (Vänsterpartiet), told of the threats he receives. 'Exterminate the **** plague,' 'Homosexuality is a mental illness that must be exterminated,' 'Society must rid it self of you ****' [...]"

[Kropotkin]

The laws and trials have different roles and rules outside of the US and other english-inspired countries.

There has been a law like this about nazism before as mentioned and there has not been a wave of arrests because of that.

If I would insult someone ( a individual) in public in the US I would probably be sued (while apparantly I should be allowed to say the same about minorites) and I'm stopped from saying such normal worlds as ****, **** etc on something as innocent as a internet forum.

I'm a bit uneasy about that kind of laws myself though. It's a result of political correctness going a bit overboard. That happens on both sides of the atlantic.

[Monk]

Oh, and DanS - Neo-nazism is very much legal here, which should indicate that it's not a law to be seriously afraid of.