Chinese moon landings

[KrazyHorse]

Originally posted by Dalgetti
I am still not sure . Where do we want those spaceships to go?

Outer system. If you don't have to lift the fuel for your rocket from Earth then you've gone a long way to making manned exploration of Jovian and Saturnian satellites possible.

[SociableMartian]

Originally posted by KrazyHorse




Not even close to funny, and errant in its assumptions. The Chinese have significant heavy-lift capabilities. They've been launching unmanned stuff for decades, and are centralised enough to easily reach deeply into the public purse to do this.

They should be putting money into improving the living standards of their huge population rather than launching expensive rockets that will offer them little to no long term benefits.

[KrazyHorse]

You aren't fg because you speaka english too good. Who are you?

What they should do has very little to do with what they will do.

[SociableMartian]

Well yes but I thought this thread was about what they should do, not what they will do. We all know they're going to take part in all these exercises to prove how much of a world superpower they are but that doesn't change the fact that they are wrong, and they will regret this in 50 years time.

[KrazyHorse]

Why? They'll spend a few billion dollars. It won't be disastrous for their economy, it'll just put a bit of a strain on it. I hope the US and EU respond by stepping up the ****-waving contest. We might actually get some serious space development money flowing back in...

[SociableMartian]

And who is FG? DL? Are these the mods or something?

[Alinestra Covelia]

Originally posted by OzzyKP
As an American patriot and anti-communist I don't see the harm in China going up into space. Good for them. It is rather biased to assume that the "evil communists" have some plot for world destruction up their sleves no matter what they do.

I agree with this. A lot of the Chinese government's policies go towards two goals - 1) securing the future safety of their own regime, and 2) securing resources and opportunities for the people they rule. Whilst not perhaps the noblest of things, it is nonetheless a pair of goals shared by all governments worth their salt.

In my limited news watching I haven't seen many hostile moves from China, and from what I hear they have no ambitions to be a world power like the US.

Agreed on the lack of hostility observation. However, your second statement is something that I don't quite agree with entirely. China right now recognizes that its main future power will be economical and tradewise, not scientific nor military. The government is already consulting with IBM as to the viability of e-commerce and e-policy, whilst still maintaining somewhat close control over the development of its economic sectors (eg regulating the population flow from rural areas to urban). Thus, although we have the space project as a final farewell feather in Jiang's political cap, I have no doubt that the future leadership will continue to carefully cultivate the vast consumer strength of China's market.

China does aspire to superpower status, but I think from any realist's viewpoint, they will only be able to do so economically in the near future. America's extensive military and scientific lead is clear.

They just want to climb the highest mountain cause its there. I respect that, hopefully our country will do more of the same.

My most fervent wish is to see the two countries go it together. Why should the world's most powerful nation be at odds with its most populous? If the question is one of mere politics, or greed, or ideology, then I think the resultant mutual alienation between these two great cultures does not justify the reasons.

[mindseye]

What a bunch of whining. A nation decides to undertake some exciting space exploration, but because it's China, the response in this thread is a load of ill-informed cynicism. Personally, I think it's rather cool that the people who invented gunpowder and rockets are now getting serious about putting men in space, and maybe even on the moon. The current program calls for a space station and shuttles as a stepping stone to lunar exploration. Why the moon? It wouldn't surprise me if China is the first to reach Mars.

There are a number of obvious benefits from a manned mission, but I'm sure prestige is number one. In a single generation, China has gone from impoverished third-world status to bustling dynamo (this year Shanghai's mag-lev railway is supposed to go operational - does your country have one of those yet?). The Chinese are justifiably proud of their impending return to superpower status, and putting someone on the moon would be quite an impressive gesture to top it off with.

There are also more practical reasons: China's space program has been generating hard income from launching satellites(including some from American firms). Research may also provide valuable technology spin-offs, as the American space program did.

China is going nowhere in manned space flight

Huh? They've already had three successful flights of the ShenZhou craft, which is capable of carrying astronauts.

I doubt that China has any serious space program plans

Manned orbiter, shuttle, space station, and a moon mission aren't serious plans? BTW, they've successfully launched about 50 satellites so far (and planning another 30 in the next five years).

The most immediate appilcation of the technology would be missiles, and a nation that can send a man to the Moon will have the tech to nuke anything else on the planet.

As others have patiently noted, China already has missile technology and ICBMs.

Hence I beleive any Chinese moves are purely political posturing

Oh, I think I see: when a nation you don't like does something for national pride, it's called "political posturing."

a response to NMD as many have said.

Um, China's space program pre-dates NMD.

They should be putting money into improving the living standards of their huge population

Rest assured vast amounts are being spent on just that objective. I think you'd be quite surprised at what life is currently like in China's big cities.

rather than launching expensive rockets that will offer them little to no long term benefits.

Uh, China's Long March series of carrier rockets have already allowed China to grab a growing slice of the lucrative international satellite-launching market. And besides, we all know that launching expensive rockets in the US produced no long term benefits either, right?

[Ecthy]

Now he LIVES in China

Hey there mindseye, long time no see here, won't you tell us soemthing about China? Why not open a thread?

[mindseye]

Now he LIVES in China

Howdy! yeah, I've been living here about 14 months now.

Hey there mindseye, long time no see here, won't you tell us soemthing about China? Why not open a thread?

Jeez, I've been regularly posting in just about every thread about China! It's hard to say anthing about "China" as it is so diverse and changing so rapidly. Shanghai, however, I can tell you a little about - it is amazing to watch a great city re-inventing itself so rapidly, right before your eyes. From my balconey I can see over 110 highrises, most of them built in the last five years - and that's just the slice of the city I can see. Shanghai is once again a modern, world-class city. I'm just a teacher living in a middle-class neighborhood, but my life is just as comfortable as it was in San Francisco. In fact, in some ways, I am more comfortable, e.g. the near absence of significant crime. Come visit and see for yourself!

[Ecthy]

There's such a thing as crime in a people's republic?

How's the population doing there? Why is it you can use the internet? Are you sure you're not a government spy?

[mindseye]

There's such a thing as crime in a people's republic?

In daily life, the only crime you really need to worry about is bicycle theft and pick-pockets ont he subway. The real crimes here are of the white collar variety, as well as corruption.

Why is it you can use the internet?

Well, like about 30-50% of Shanghai households, I have a personal computer. I just plug it into the phone line, and voila! For those who don't have PCs, there are "net bars" everywhere, people go there to play network games, surf, do email and messaging, etc. C'mon, don't you know that Chinese is the #2 language of the internet?

[Ecthy]

But.... there are... so many.... rumors in the west...

[The Mad Monk]

That building on the right in the background of the photo is gorgeous. Very interesting archetecture.

As for the topic...more power to them!

[Ecthy]

Now Andy did you hear about his one? Yes I did! :-D

If you believe, they'll put a man on the moon