Would Finland have been better off if it had remained part of Russia?

[Lancer]

Brave Finland fought the Russians once, and the Russians paid a terrible price. In the end the Fins lost a little bit of land and a few islands.

The Russians lost tens of thousands of dead and they found out one very important thing.

[RGBVideo]

Originally posted by Lancer
Brave Finland fought the Russians once, and the Russians paid a terrible price. In the end the Fins lost a little bit of land and a few islands.(..)

...because USSR was not technologically advanced and used tanks which
engine destroyed after few molotovs, and which movement got jammed after
few sticks of wood were at their... erm... movement... things...

[Mr. President]

I'm neither Finnish nor Russian, but I'm inclined to think "no" nonetheless.

[Hydey]

Isn't Russia part of the great Finland nation.

[Meticulous Man]

Originally posted by Tuomerehu


Ethnic groups -- > Lapps and Russians are hardly a major ethnic group in Finland.
Finns themselves are split up in to very many cultural and ethnic minorities.

[Provost Harrison]

I see AH is going for oneupmanship on BFB

[Serb]

Originally posted by Tuomerehu


...because USSR was not technologically advanced and used tanks which
engine destroyed after few molotovs, and which movement got jammed after
few sticks of wood were at their... erm... movement... things...

Blah..Blah..Blah....
It was very cold winter -40C and even -50C. It was impossible to use tanks at such teperatures because engines don't started. Plus you had the best fortification of that times the Mannergaim's Line. And Finaly in 1944 all Finish army plus 15 German divisions located on Finish territory was defeated in one forceful blow.

[Goingonit]

I saw this thread, my first thought was, "oh no, not again!"

I looked at the thread, and marvelled at the fact that this was actually a serious discussion.

Russia would have been better off as a part of Finland. Finnish life expectancy and quality of life is higher immediately across the border, AFAIK. The Finns should teach us all their secrets!

[-=Vagrant=-]

The Horror...the horror

Finland as part of that ramshackle corrupt piece of "Goverment"?
That would be Hell! Well, maybe we could, as a province of Russia, bring it back to its feet. The whole country went down the drain in the 90's. But fortunately it looks like Russia can become a real democracy in 30 years or so.
Oh and Serb. please don't start that: but WE could have won if it wasn't for that cold weather and those nasty Finnish skitroops.
CCCP "lost" the Winter War, i.e. didn't capture Finland, because of lack of leadership and the old combat doctrines. Wide thick rows of russian troops advacing towards Finnish positions and every one got gunned down. Finnish troops could not believe that the russians just allowed themselves to be massacred like that. That is the reason one Finnish troops equals ten Russian troops. Or did equal.
But enough of that. It's in the past and only few veterans are alive today. I have the greatest respect for them. Without them there would be no Finland. Just another corrupt Ex-soviet occupation dump.

[Hurricane]

Originally posted by Serb

Blah..Blah..Blah....
It was very cold winter -40C and even -50C. It was impossible to use tanks at such teperatures because engines don't started. Plus you had the best fortification of that times the Mannergaim's Line. And Finaly in 1944 all Finish army plus 15 German divisions located on Finish territory was defeated in one forceful blow.

I guess Serb is just provoking, but since we have a lot of people not very knowing of Finnish history, I will have to correct Serb´s gross exaggerations.

First, the Mannerheim Line was not "the best fortification of that times". Far from it. It was just a line of scattered bunkers and trenches. What made it so hard to penetrate was the favourable terrain for defence, thanks to the large number of small lakes. Here is a link to a russian site about the Mannerheim Line.

Second, the Finnish army was NOT defeated in 1944. The Russians were in fact completely stopped, at the battle of Tali-Ihantala. To cite another Russian source (the book Bitva za Leningrad 1941-1944 (The Battle of Leningrad) edited by Lt.-Gen. S.P. Platonov), it is stated:

The repeated offensive attempts by the Soviet Forces failed . . . to gain results. The enemy succeeded in significantly tightening its ranks in this area and repulse all the attacks of our troops . . . During the offensive operations lasting over three weeks, from June 21 to mid-July, the forces of the right flank of the Leningrad front failed to carry out the tasks assigned to them on the orders of the Supreme Command issued on June 21st.

The Russians understood that the Finnish army had a lot of power left, and with the race for Berlin taking priority, Soviet decided to let Finland sign a peace with them. Finland was the only Axis country who did not capitulate, and was neither occupied at any time.

By the way, the Soviets did not destroy the German divisions in Finland, either. The peace treaty included a demand that the Finns drive the Germans out of Lapland, so Finland had to take care of them, too.

[-=Vagrant=-]

Yeah! We kicked some Rusky butt and some Nazi butt.
[78% Provocation incluted]

[Zoid]

Hey, Finland belongs to Sweden. Just because we lost it to Russia in 1809 doesn´t mean it isn´t ours. Damn, where is UN when you need them

I demand a return to the borders of 1658!

[-=Vagrant=-]

Originally posted by Kamrat X
Hey, Finland belongs to Sweden. Just because we lost it to Russia in 1809 doesn´t mean it isn´t ours. Damn, where is UN when you need them

I demand a return to the borders of 1658!

Actually, I can concur with this. Sweden is much more advanced in social rights and sexual equality. And when Sweden has Finland back they have a real cell-phone manufacturer! heheh.
Who did you fight against to have Finland under your rule?
Hint: it wasn't the russians.

[Stefu]

Well, consider Australia. Established by bunch of criminals, who later moved away when goings started to get really unintelligent. Lately, they haven't done much anything, except imported Paul Hogan and elected big-eyebrowed creepazoid as their PM. In fact, re-election of said creepazoid proves Australians are uncapable of deciding about issues of their country. The whole girt in the sea should be ceded back to England. Maybe they'd then get some civilization, apart from subtle arts of sheep-****ging.

Now, Finland back to Russia? Reminds me of an old joke:

Back during the cold war, Kekkonen was yet again entertaining Brezhnev. The boys went hunting in lush Finnish forests, then went to sauna, and then started drinking. The night got on, and at one point Brezhnev said:

"Hey Urho... I've been thinking... this border between our countries... why is it there? Let's just remove it... create one big nation... whaddaya say?"

Kekkonen thinks a bit, then replies:

"I appreciate the offer, Leonid... I really appreciate it... but let's face it. I'm an old man; how could I lead a big nation like that?"

Sweden is much more advanced in social rights and sexual equality.

Well, except when we come to right of fur farmers to make their living. And let's not forget our dear neighbor country's contribution to sexual equality: Removal of urinals from elementary schools, because men's ability to pee standing up is unfair.

[Zoid]

Originally posted by Stefu
Well, except when we come to right of fur farmers to make their living. And let's not forget our dear neighbor country's contribution to sexual equality: Removal of urinals from elementary schools, because men's ability to pee standing up is unfair.

Fur farming is an unethical business and should be banned! As for the removal of urinals, that´s news for me. But I´m sure that it hasn´t got anything to do with equality (if it wasn´t done in the 70´s, then anything is possible ) Do you know when it was done?