The Altera Centauri collection has been brought up to date by Darsnan. It comprises every decent scenario he's been able to find anywhere on the web, going back over 20 years.
25 themes/skins/styles are now available to members. Check the select drop-down at the bottom-left of each page.
Call To Power 2 Cradle 3+ mod in progress: https://apolyton.net/forum/other-games/call-to-power-2/ctp2-creation/9437883-making-cradle-3-fully-compatible-with-the-apolyton-edition
Announcement
Collapse
No announcement yet.
Political part : Biggest earthquake in 40 years hits Southeast Asia
You think this is a question of infrastructure? What infrastructure can withstand something like the Amazonas river washing over it? What hospital system could handle that number of injured?
Edit: Giancarlo beat me to it.
So get your Naomi Klein books and move it or I'll seriously bash your faces in! - Supercitizen to stupid students Be kind to the nerdiest guy in school. He will be your boss when you've grown up!
Thought maybe I would put it in this thread instead of the others. I don't see why anyone would come too hard down on NOAA after the fact when it wasn't their responsiblity to watch the Indian Ocean. they should develop better protocals to pass what info they do get though.
NOAA's lack of staff, funding hobbled alerts
WASHINGTON (AP) -- The U.S. weather agency didn't have the phone numbers nor staff to alert all Indian Ocean coastal countries when it saw the first signs that tsunamis could be heading their way, its top official said Thursday.
He cautioned that the Caribbean and Atlantic also lack an early warning system.
In the face of stern questioning by some in Congress over whether enough was done, the head of the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration said his agency did all it was responsible for doing in warning 26 countries in the Pacific.
"We cannot watch tsunamis in the Indian Ocean," said Conrad C. Lautenbacher, the Commerce Department's undersecretary for oceans and atmosphere and a retired Navy vice admiral, noting that no warning system exists for all 11 countries where the death toll has now topped 117,000.
"Folks out there tried to contact people that they thought would be interested. ... They did what they thought at the time were the most prudent things to do," he said. "If we can improve it, believe me, we will improve it."
In an interview with The Associated Press, Lautenbacher said he had ordered an internal review of its response to the quake and tsunamis.
He said he also has asked NOAA staff to look at creating a "rapid reaction" emergency team and a more global warning system.
Lautenbacher said the chances of a major earthquake in the Atlantic Ocean "are small, but they're not zero."
"There is the potential of tsunami damage" in the Caribbean, he said, "and we believe that (warning) coverage should be extended to those areas as well."
In the past 150 years, the Caribbean has had more than 50 tsunamis and the Atlantic more than 30, about half off the U.S. and Canadian coasts but none since 1964, NOAA figures show.
Some scientists had urged both the Clinton and Bush administrations to create a tsunami warning system in the Atlantic and the Caribbean, but they say nothing much happened.
"One option we explored as recently as a few months ago was to ask for money to have the seismic network at the university here become a 24-hour operation. ... But again there is no money," University of Puerto Rico oceanographer Aurelio Mercado-Irizarry said Thursday from Mayaguez.
"Based on the magnitude of what happened in the Indian Ocean, I think something must be done, but at what level and what expense is the question," Mercado-Irizarry told the AP.
A huge earthquake off Lisbon, Portugal's coast in 1755 generated tsunamis that crossed the Atlantic and wreaked havoc in the Caribbean and the West Coast of Africa, he said.
Lautenbacher might be called to testify about the U.S. response to the tsunamis -- and what can be done to beef up warnings for the Caribbean and Atlantic regions -- before the Senate Commerce Committee's oceans, fisheries and Coast Guard subcommittee.
Fifteen minutes after Sunday's quake near Sumatra, NOAA fired off a bulletin from Hawaii to 26 Pacific nations that now make up the International Coordination Group for the Tsunami Warning System, alerting them of the quake but saying they faced no threat of a tsunami.
Fifty minutes later, the U.S. agency upgraded the severity of the quake and again said there was no tsunami threat in the Pacific, but identified the possibility of a tsunami near the quake's epicenter in the Indian Ocean.
After nearly another half hour, NOAA contacted emergency officials in Australia as a backstop, knowing they would quickly contact their counterparts in Indonesia.
It wasn't until 21/2 hours after the quake that NOAA officials learned from Internet news reports that a destructive tsunami had hit Sri Lanka.
"The fact that the potential danger rose to the level of prompting a swift warning to two nations, while others could be faced with a potentially devastating impact, raises serious questions," the Senate oceans subcommittee chair, Sen. Olympia Snowe, of Maine, said in a letter to Lautenbacher.
Lautenbacher said there was only so much NOAA can do.
"The system is set up for the Pacific, and it is resourced and it is staffed to operate for the Pacific. It is not resourced or staffed to do the world," he said.
Among the 11 nations reporting deaths, only Indonesia received any warning from NOAA, and then only indirectly through Australia.
After reports of casualties in his country, a Sri Lankan Navy commander called the Hawaii warning center to ask about the potential for more tsunamis. The U.S. ambassador in Sri Lanka also called the center asking to be notified of any big aftershocks.
Meanwhile, India's science and technology minister requested an investigation into a report that his country's air force base was told of a massive quake an hour before the tsunami hit its southern shore but disaster officials were notified too late to take action to protect people.
Which side are we on? We're on the side of the demons, Chief. We are evil men in the gardens of paradise, sent by the forces of death to spread devastation and destruction wherever we go. I'm surprised you didn't know that. --Saul Tigh
Originally posted by Giancarlo
But your own government is responsible for you if you get killed or injured, or stranded... in helping find you and get you back to the country. This isn't a nanny state we are talking about.
In theory yes, but in the real world if you rely on your goverment to do too much then your just asking for trouble. There is the cliche line of the American threatening to call their Congressman when things don't go their way. What a country can do for it's citizens overseas is limited.
I will say that a couple thousand should be a big deal though. Something that any goverment would have to sit up and take notice of.
Which side are we on? We're on the side of the demons, Chief. We are evil men in the gardens of paradise, sent by the forces of death to spread devastation and destruction wherever we go. I'm surprised you didn't know that. --Saul Tigh
You think this is a question of infrastructure? What infrastructure can withstand something like the Amazonas river washing over it? What hospital system could handle that number of injured?
Reasonably well? Ours. Yours. Each major hospital in the US has "life flight" helicopters -- normally to save people from car wrecks. Every major freeway can land C-130 transports due to the requirements of the Cold War. Pretty much every county has an airport for smaller planes, in the alternative.
I came upon a barroom full of bad Salon pictures in which men with hats on the backs of their heads were wolfing food from a counter. It was the institution of the "free lunch" I had struck. You paid for a drink and got as much as you wanted to eat. For something less than a rupee a day a man can feed himself sumptuously in San Francisco, even though he be a bankrupt. Remember this if ever you are stranded in these parts. ~ Rudyard Kipling, 1891
In theory yes, but in the real world if you rely on your goverment to do too much then your just asking for trouble. There is the cliche line of the American threatening to call their Congressman when things don't go their way. What a country can do for it's citizens overseas is limited.
I will say that a couple thousand should be a big deal though. Something that any goverment would have to sit up and take notice of.
No but say you lose your passports and get stranded.. or even arrested.. it is up to the embassy to a least get you into contact with family back home. It is up to the embassy staff at these countries to get these people at least contacted with their family back home so something can be done.
If it is one person who dies, then yes, the family back at home should take care of it themselves. However, if it is several thousand, then it is the responsibility of the government to act fast.
For there is [another] kind of violence, slower but just as deadly, destructive as the shot or the bomb in the night. This is the violence of institutions -- indifference, inaction, and decay. This is the violence that afflicts the poor, that poisons relations between men because their skin has different colors. - Bobby Kennedy (Mindless Menance of Violence)
BBC, News, BBC News, news online, world, uk, international, foreign, british, online, service
don't worry. Unlike some of you america haters, I have faith the U.S. will eventually raise their total. It's not like the money does a whole lot of good at this point. They have plenty of money, just no infrastructure to put the money to good use. More money will be needed later as the actual reconstruction begins.
Originally posted by Chemical Ollie
You think this is a question of infrastructure? What infrastructure can withstand something like the Amazonas river washing over it? What hospital system could handle that number of injured?
Edit: Giancarlo beat me to it.
A person with a hotmail account and the noaa on his favorites list could have gotten warning to people. This was not a question of what to do about all the unprepared dead people, its a question of how to prepare and warn people, and they willfully dropped the ball. the Thai's didn't send out a warning because it might hurt their tourism industry.
I think it is safe to say that we have most likely seen the most important event of the decade and possibly since the collapse of Communism, a catastrophe that, hopefully will put 9-11 in perspective for a lot of Americans. But not if they watch CNN.
My wife and I have been viewing CNN throughout the evening, and I finally seen the ultimate in parochial American news. In a description of the tsunami's effects throughout Asia, the following line (paraphrased!) was used...
"... Sri Lanka... meanwhile, miles away in Indonesia... "
Then I saw that GW and his brother Jeb are going to visit, Jeb coming along because he has "experience in dealing with large scale catastrophes as governor of Florida."
Sorry, but Jeb first is going to have to get a proper perspective on the scale of this disaster: There is what, 1000-5000 miles of devastated coastland, stretching from Indonesia all the way across the belly of Asia through India and Sri Lanka, washing over the Maldives, ending its made for TV journey all the way in Africa (5000-6000 miles away?)? There's going to be a quarter million officially perished because of the tsunami, there could be as many to die because of disease (and what a fertile feeding and breeding ground for any new nasty diseases that would like to crop up?). Jeb and Dubya are most likely expecting devastation on the scale of Andrew, "just bigger." Well, they're going to get it. But it's not going to be just bigger, it'll be broader, more in depth, more overwhelming as the President's helicopter flies miles after miles after miles of tsunami destruction - only to realize that they haven't even left Indonesia (or wherever) yet.
And here's CNN, supposedly a premiere international news network, describing the distance between Sri Lanka and Indonesia as mere "miles".
Then, in another segment, they describe the recipients of the first aid shipment of supplies as being reduced to "a pack of animals" because they were ducking as they were approaching the helicopter, without once considering that the people might be ducking underneath the ROTATING PROPELLERS on the friggin' HELICOPTER. Also, they might also be worried about getting shot if they rush too soon. Dumbasses.
Since this is a political thread, let me ask a question: If John Kerry had won, what would be the Bush administrations reaction? I think Bush would give more, knowing that Kerry was going to have to foot the bill, knowing that Kerry couldn't very well object to the outgoing President's grand gesture of $25 billion in aid.
By the way, bad things occur in three. 9-11... SE Asia tsunami... ???
Lastly: what should we call this disaster? The Wave? It does has a connotation to an American baseball idiom, but I don't think that should discount this for the billions who don't follow baseball.
and I really do not like people comparing this to 9/11. The news is doing it all the time
9/11 really wasn't that bad when you think about it. I still don't understand what the big deal is. Only 3000 dead. Yeah it seemed like a big deal at the time, nothing seemed bigger. But then **** like this happens, and you realize 9/11 wasn't ****.
Originally posted by Dissident
and I really do not like people comparing this to 9/11. The news is doing it all the time
9/11 really wasn't that bad when you think about it. I still don't understand what the big deal is. Only 3000 dead. Yeah it seemed like a big deal at the time, nothing seemed bigger. But then **** like this happens, and you realize 9/11 wasn't ****.
I favor comparisons that show how vast this problem is compared to 9-11.
After 9-11, $1.1 billion was given by private charities including Andrew Mellon's donation of $50,500,000 to "NYC cultural and performing arts directly affected by September 11th, plus support to existing disaster relief." How much of the infrastructure in the Maldives will $50,000,000 rebuild? http://fdncenter.org/research/trends...f/9_11updt.pdf
Governments were even hastier to spend, bailing out industry left and right - do you know, in the airline industry the US government bailed out the equivalent of SEVEN Chryslers in the aftermath of 9-11, and nobody, not a one, batted an eye. Thanks, Jimmy Carter - your legacy lives on. Last thing anybody, especially any politician, wanted to do was to have others think that they "didn't care" about 9-11.
I agree with Egelund: people, Americans, have been stingy with this disaster and that is to our shame.
that may be true, but let me again mention the typhoon of 1991 which killed about the same number of peopel.
strange how people's memories are short. Myself included. I forgot all about that typhoon.
and this catastrophe cannot compare to the genocides in africa.
Yep. Like I said before, this could've been a lot worse. Let's not blow it out of proportion; nature is fully capable of dealing out something more disastrous than this earthquake/tsunami.
I agree with Egelund: people, Americans, have been stingy with this disaster and that is to our shame.
We all have to be very careful and not just throw money at the situation. Whether you like to admit it or not, there is a lot of corruption in many of these countries that were hit and throwing money at it won't solve a thing. A lot of this money would just disappear if used the wrong way. And I say again lets keep the UN role to a minimum. If they want to cook food and pass out blankets, and maybe help with medicine.. okay.. but they shouldn't head anything because they would screw it up.
For there is [another] kind of violence, slower but just as deadly, destructive as the shot or the bomb in the night. This is the violence of institutions -- indifference, inaction, and decay. This is the violence that afflicts the poor, that poisons relations between men because their skin has different colors. - Bobby Kennedy (Mindless Menance of Violence)
I have to agree with that. If Sweden and the rest of the world was slow to react, the UN again showed that it was even more slow. Only after the US, Japan, Australia and some other countries had formed a core help group did Kofi Annan grumpily wake up and complain that the UN should lead it.
I favor comparisons that show how vast this problem is compared to 9-11.
After 9-11, $1.1 billion was given by private charities including Andrew Mellon's donation of $50,500,000 to "NYC cultural and performing arts directly affected by September 11th, plus support to existing disaster relief." How much of the infrastructure in the Maldives will $50,000,000 rebuild? http://fdncenter.org/research/trends...f/9_11updt.pdf
Governments were even hastier to spend, bailing out industry left and right - do you know, in the airline industry the US government bailed out the equivalent of SEVEN Chryslers in the aftermath of 9-11, and nobody, not a one, batted an eye. Thanks, Jimmy Carter - your legacy lives on. Last thing anybody, especially any politician, wanted to do was to have others think that they "didn't care" about 9-11.
I agree with Egelund: people, Americans, have been stingy with this disaster and that is to our shame.
americans are stingy? I think not.
We will end up spending billions.
It costs $120,000 a day just to operate one aircraft carrier. The U.S. navy operations alone will go into the millions.
Tweet
Comment