Tweet
Originally posted by Spec
Death toll tops 13000. not 90.
Spec.
Death toll tops 13000. not 90.
Spec.
And it is 125,000.
-
Your article is four days out of date.
And it is 125,000.
For there is [another] kind of violence, slower but just as deadly, destructive as the shot or the bomb in the night. This is the violence of institutions -- indifference, inaction, and decay. This is the violence that afflicts the poor, that poisons relations between men because their skin has different colors. - Bobby Kennedy (Mindless Menance of Violence) -
I agree that certain parts of UN either are fck'ed up in politics, others seems deeply involved in regular swindle, but i think that the catastrophe aid sections usually works (maybe not fast, but they are reliable).
But i must admit I felt rather sick reading this :
Since when has UN achieved moral superiority ? I know that it isn't what she says, but is it possible to interpret it in other ways ?“Only really the UN can do that job,” she told BBC Radio Four’s PM programme.
“It is the only body that has the moral authority. But it can only do it well if it is backed up by the authority of the great powers.”
I read this as "not good coordinating with UN", and that is sometimes good. Currently Iraq.She said the US was “very bad at coordinating with anyone” and India had its own problems to deal with.With or without religion, you would have good people doing good things and evil people doing evil things. But for good people to do evil things, that takes religion.
Steven WeinbergComment
-
If you check a new thread by Spec, then you know why he isn't updated - he has done grim things to his collectionOriginally posted by Giancarlo
Your article is four days out of date.
Edit : should have put this in from the beginning :
Last edited by BlackCat; December 30, 2004, 19:45.With or without religion, you would have good people doing good things and evil people doing evil things. But for good people to do evil things, that takes religion.
Steven WeinbergComment
-
Canada has upped its pleague to $40M + has agreed to match dollars donated by Canadians to aid agencies.
For the benefit of any Canadians that reley on OT for all their news :
Canadian Red Cross/ Earthquake relief : 1-800-416-1111
World Vision Canada : 1-866-595-5550
UNICEF/Tsunami victims : 1-800-567-4483
If you can afford the internet and Civ games, you can afford to give a donation. UNICEF got $50 from me yesterday.There's nothing wrong with the dream, my friend, the problem lies with the dreamer.Comment
-
UNICEF btw is on the ground in all the effected countries iirc except Myanmar and Somalia. Give them the money, they can get the job done locally.There's nothing wrong with the dream, my friend, the problem lies with the dreamer.Comment
-
$350 million
is that enough for you all?
or is the U.S. still being stingy?
Comment
-
Nope. Denmark are contributing 300 Mill and we are only 5 mill people. Oups, it's danish crowns, which is approx 41 M$.
It doesn't even help that the US figure will be revised when need occurs - you can add just as many zeros to the figure and still there will be crazyheads that will claim that it's not enough and that Bush/US is to blame for the broken glasses at moms birthday.
With or without religion, you would have good people doing good things and evil people doing evil things. But for good people to do evil things, that takes religion.
Steven WeinbergComment
-
$350 million
is that enough for you all?
See... the comments WORKED!“I give you a new commandment, that you love one another. Just as I have loved you, you also should love one another. By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you have love for one another.”
- John 13:34-35 (NRSV)Comment
-
No, Imran.. it had nothing to do with the comments.. the US carrier group was assessing the damage and it was soon known more had to be pledged. The UN can kiss my rear end because they don't influence anything in the US.For there is [another] kind of violence, slower but just as deadly, destructive as the shot or the bomb in the night. This is the violence of institutions -- indifference, inaction, and decay. This is the violence that afflicts the poor, that poisons relations between men because their skin has different colors. - Bobby Kennedy (Mindless Menance of Violence)Comment
-
Is there not going to be any coordianation at all? I saw on CNN where Thailand was actually concerned that aid was coming too swiftly for it to handle. Someone mentioned at good idea that some of the things they really need are helicopters and engineers to get in there and start fixing runways for planes to land on. Anyone sending in combat engineers and such to get emergency infrastructure in the areas where everything has been washed away. All the money in the world isnt going to do much good while no one can actually put supplies on the ground.Which side are we on? We're on the side of the demons, Chief. We are evil men in the gardens of paradise, sent by the forces of death to spread devastation and destruction wherever we go. I'm surprised you didn't know that. --Saul TighComment
-
350
USA
So get your Naomi Klein books and move it or I'll seriously bash your faces in! - Supercitizen to stupid students
Be kind to the nerdiest guy in school. He will be your boss when you've grown up!Comment
-
I don't think Thailand need much outside help, because it's a quite rich country in comparison and foreign tourist made up most of the victims.Originally posted by Sprayber
Is there not going to be any coordianation at all? I saw on CNN where Thailand was actually concerned that aid was coming too swiftly for it to handle. Someone mentioned at good idea that some of the things they really need are helicopters and engineers to get in there and start fixing runways for planes to land on. Anyone sending in combat engineers and such to get emergency infrastructure in the areas where everything has been washed away. All the money in the world isnt going to do much good while no one can actually put supplies on the ground.
The countries in most urgent need are Sri Lanka and Indonesia. And some remote islands we don't yet even know what happened to.
USA has turned down a request from the Swedish Government to assist with airlift capability. I hope that's because those airplanes where on their way to help poorer countries than Sweden. (I thought the Swedish request was selfish and greedy. We are a rich country and have at least 8 Hercules planes ourselves, which should be enough to transport the zink coffins for our dead. And the planes we don't have ourselves, we can afford to hire.)So get your Naomi Klein books and move it or I'll seriously bash your faces in! - Supercitizen to stupid students
Be kind to the nerdiest guy in school. He will be your boss when you've grown up!Comment
-
Uggghhh!See... the comments WORKED!I came upon a barroom full of bad Salon pictures in which men with hats on the backs of their heads were wolfing food from a counter. It was the institution of the "free lunch" I had struck. You paid for a drink and got as much as you wanted to eat. For something less than a rupee a day a man can feed himself sumptuously in San Francisco, even though he be a bankrupt. Remember this if ever you are stranded in these parts. ~ Rudyard Kipling, 1891Comment
-
I don't think we have airlift capacity to the tune that would be required. Flights for our soldiers to the mideast are purchased from commercial sources, for instance. So Sweden's krones are no worse than American dollars in this regard.USA has turned down a request from the Swedish Government to assist with airlift capability. I hope that's because those airplanes where on their way to help poorer countries than Sweden.
In any event, I agree that Swedes should be given no particular preference by the US for flights out (but preference by the Swedish government, of course) relative to other relief needs. It would probably be cheaper to feed the Swedes in SE Asia than to send them to Sweden, for instance.I came upon a barroom full of bad Salon pictures in which men with hats on the backs of their heads were wolfing food from a counter. It was the institution of the "free lunch" I had struck. You paid for a drink and got as much as you wanted to eat. For something less than a rupee a day a man can feed himself sumptuously in San Francisco, even though he be a bankrupt. Remember this if ever you are stranded in these parts. ~ Rudyard Kipling, 1891Comment
-
I think that they are trying to coordinate as hard as they can, but the task is immense. More than four countries are involved (four major and a couple minor), thousands and thousands of square kilometres are involved and infrastructure is in several areas nonexistent.Originally posted by Sprayber
Is there not going to be any coordianation at all? I saw on CNN where Thailand was actually concerned that aid was coming too swiftly for it to handle. Someone mentioned at good idea that some of the things they really need are helicopters and engineers to get in there and start fixing runways for planes to land on. Anyone sending in combat engineers and such to get emergency infrastructure in the areas where everything has been washed away. All the money in the world isnt going to do much good while no one can actually put supplies on the ground.
Helicopters are good in such a situation, but they have one big flaw. If i'm not wrong, they need 4-5 (man)hours maintenace for each hour they are in the air, so you can't just say "lets send a couple of hundreds helicopters", they need massive backup.
The same goes for "combat engineers", they need supplies, equipment etc, so you can't just send thousands of those to the area in short notice. Secondly, soldiers can give political headeggs (sounds as simple
) - just take the Israeli group that was supposed to go to Sri lanka, theyt weren't allowed because they was military (if i'm not wrong, the real reason was that some muslim groups didn't like israelis in Sri lanka )
Another thing is the timeframe. It's six days since it happend, it took a couple of days for everybody to realize the size of the catastrophe, and the place is quite far away in terms of travel.
You are right about the money. At the moment money isn't the issue, although some people thinks that if you just spend a lot of money, then all problems are solved.
With or without religion, you would have good people doing good things and evil people doing evil things. But for good people to do evil things, that takes religion.
Steven WeinbergComment
Comment