Baghdad Violence (pic heavy)

[Patroklos]

1/10.

That was trully pitiful.

[Pyrodrew]

Originally posted by Patroklos
Damn those professionals who know what their doing for not consulting Civilization players.

If the OTF took turns controlling the US military actions in Iraq I'm sure all the people in this thread, who are experts in military strategy and military ethics, would be pleased as they would never make mistakes and handle everything perfectly. The only time they would not be pleased would be when it was not their turn. As it is now they never get a turn.

[The Mad Monk]

Sort of like the late stages of a Civ III game.

[Spiffor]

I still wonder why the word "terrorist" is used to describe the people who attacked the tank.

It is an act of non-terrorist guerilla in the purest definition of the word. To call the perpetrators of this attack "terrorists" demeans the word into becoming "anybody we d'ont like"

[Spiffor]

Originally posted by Patroklos
Seems to be the case with all wars. The opposite opionion usually happens after the war.

I cannot find any war that I wouldn't describe as "horrifying", even with decades of hindsight. And I can't think of any war that was "good in theory" either, even though I know many believe the Serbia war and the Afghanistan war were "good in theory".

[Drake Tungsten]

And I can't think of any war that was "good in theory" either

American Revolution

[Az]

yeah, thus making the true terrorists more exceptable.

[Spiffor]

Originally posted by Drake Tungsten
American Revolution

Ah yeah, I didn't think about independence wars, that's right. The ones I thought about (Algeria and Indochina war), I saw from the perspective of a colonial war, instead of the perspective of an idenpendence war.

[Az]

Well, the whole debate is stupid. Was WWII good? no. Doesn't mean the allies shouldn't have fought it...

[Spiffor]

Originally posted by Azazel
Well, the whole debate is stupid. Was WWII good? no. Doesn't mean the allies shouldn't have fought it...

The whole debate is stupid, but I'll nitpick with you nonetheless: WW2 was definitely bad in theory, except in the sick megalomaniac mind that started it. In general, you evaluate the "moral" aspect of the war on the motivations of those who start it.
WWI was pure imperialism and nationalist bigotry. WWII was the product of a sick mind and a will of revenge by a Volk. I can't see how we lubrul weenies can consider them any "good in theory".

Now, I'm not judging those who had the war thrust upon them. When you're invaded, it is quite the default behaviour to wage war.

[Az]

In general, you evaluate the "moral" aspect of the war on the motivations of those who start it.

In that case, would you support a war in Iraq if you believed that Bush was really to create peace and prosperity in Iraq?

[Spiffor]

Originally posted by Azazel
In that case, would you support a war in Iraq if you believed that Bush was really to create peace and prosperity in Iraq?

I would have been far less opposed than what I was (and still am). I would have been opposed nonetheless, because I'd have considered that the democracy he'd established would be bunk, given that populations have to develop their own democratic traditions by themselves if democracy is to be successful, and not at gunpoint.

[Az]

So, the goals are not your consideration, but the effects... I fully agree with you.

[Dis]

Originally posted by Spiffor
I still wonder why the word "terrorist" is used to describe the people who attacked the tank.

It is an act of non-terrorist guerilla in the purest definition of the word. To call the perpetrators of this attack "terrorists" demeans the word into becoming "anybody we d'ont like"

good point. I suspect most of these people are not terrorists.

If they attack the U.S. military- they are not terrorist. Period.

Now the attacks on the police stations against men who haven't even signed up for the police force yet could be considered terrorism. Because those attacks are meant to terrorize the civilian populations. where as attacks against the U.S. military are designed to get the U.S. to withdraw.

[MalevolentLight]

Now, I'm not judging those who had the war thrust upon them. When you're invaded, it is quite the default behaviour to wage war.

Unless you live in France. Then the default behavior is to join them.