Tweet
Originally posted by Drake Tungsten
What do you think brought Gorbachev to power?
What do you think brought Gorbachev to power?
-
The death of Chernenko (sp?) and Andropov and with them the weakening of the old more militant guard?If you don't like reality, change it! me
"Oh no! I am bested!" Drake
"it is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong" Voltaire
"Patriotism is a pernecious, psychopathic form of idiocy" George Bernard Shaw -
Or pressure from Reagan that led the hard-liners to believe that reform (and therefore Gorbachev) was the necessary course of action.KH FOR OWNER!
ASHER FOR CEO!!
GUYNEMER FOR OT MOD!!!Comment
-
Andropov was a reformer too. After all, he was the person who endowed Gorby with so much power. And Ronnie's reactions did much to disuade the Politburo from reform.
Look, say you're in the Politburo. What would convince you to adopt reformist policies: a trigger happy madman running a rival state or a reasonable person willing to bargain with you? Or look at it the other way around; if you're in the Congress, whose acsension to power would convince you to adopt more tolerant policies towards political dissidents: Brehznev or Gorby?"Beware of the man who works hard to learn something, learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before. He is full of murderous resentment of people who are ignorant without having come by their ignorance the hard way. "
-BokononComment
-
Why would I need to reform if my opponent was willing to bargain with me? The system will continue to limp along like it has for decades if my opponent doesn't pressure me at all.
A "trigger happy madman", OTOH, is a huge challenge that strains my overburdened system and makes reform a necessity.KH FOR OWNER!
ASHER FOR CEO!!
GUYNEMER FOR OT MOD!!!Comment
-
It's harder to get away with reaction without an evil enemy ready to rain down nukes on your populace.
Repressive governments don't internally crumble due to the animosity of rival states."Beware of the man who works hard to learn something, learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before. He is full of murderous resentment of people who are ignorant without having come by their ignorance the hard way. "
-BokononComment
-
It's harder to get away with reaction without an evil enemy ready to rain down nukes on your populace.
Repressive governments don't internally crumble due to the animosity of rival states.
They do when forced to engage in risky reforms by a ruinous arms race that they can't afford...KH FOR OWNER!
ASHER FOR CEO!!
GUYNEMER FOR OT MOD!!!Comment
-
Foreign agression has always been one of the strongest justifications for repressive policies."Beware of the man who works hard to learn something, learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before. He is full of murderous resentment of people who are ignorant without having come by their ignorance the hard way. "
-BokononComment
-
Reagan's policies weren't agression. They were a more active and belligerant defense.KH FOR OWNER!
ASHER FOR CEO!!
GUYNEMER FOR OT MOD!!!Comment
-
They do when forced to engage in risky reforms by a ruinous arms race that they can't afford...
How were they forced to engage in reforms? I don't see the justification. The previous time a reformist government was in the Kremlin, was when Kruschev was in power. And we were completely unreasonable with him, causing the Politburo to depose him in favor of conservative Brehznev.
And the arms race wasn't ruinous to the gov't. The response to the SDI was only a small portion of the Soviet military budget."Beware of the man who works hard to learn something, learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before. He is full of murderous resentment of people who are ignorant without having come by their ignorance the hard way. "
-BokononComment
-
Reagan's policies weren't agression. They were a more active and belligerant defense.
Whatever, "belligerance" if you prefer. The statment still holds."Beware of the man who works hard to learn something, learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before. He is full of murderous resentment of people who are ignorant without having come by their ignorance the hard way. "
-BokononComment
-
SDI was only a small part of the arms race.
The statment still holds.
No, it doesn't. Belligerance and aggression are not the same thing.KH FOR OWNER!
ASHER FOR CEO!!
GUYNEMER FOR OT MOD!!!Comment
-
It was the arms race while Reagan was in power."Beware of the man who works hard to learn something, learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before. He is full of murderous resentment of people who are ignorant without having come by their ignorance the hard way. "
-BokononComment
-
What about intermediate-range ballistic missiles?
Or the navy?
Or some other parts of the $1.5 trillion defense spending increase under Reagan that I'm forgetting about?Last edited by Drake Tungsten; June 9, 2004, 12:27.KH FOR OWNER!
ASHER FOR CEO!!
GUYNEMER FOR OT MOD!!!Comment
-
Dear Ronnie,
Thanks for selling us the Stingers and the niner Limas when you weren't supposed to. They helped win us the war, and your arms manufacturers can rest assured they worked.
Best wishes for Nancy
Mags "PukkaUp" ThatchSome cry `Allah O Akbar` in the street. And some carry Allah in their heart.
"The CIA does nothing, says nothing, allows nothing, unless its own interests are served. They are the biggest assembly of liars and theives this country ever put under one roof and they are an abomination" Deputy COS (Intel) US Army 1981-84Comment
-
I'm not interested in a semantics debate. To be mrfunning,No, it doesn't. Belligerance and aggression are not the same thing.
"It's harder to get away with reaction without an evil enemy ready to rain down nukes on your populace.""Beware of the man who works hard to learn something, learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before. He is full of murderous resentment of people who are ignorant without having come by their ignorance the hard way. "
-BokononComment
Comment