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*shrug*
Basing greatness on popularity is very dubious. As is critical success at the time. Certainly Pet Sounds was blasted critically and sold the lowest of any Beach Boys album to that date, yet today we see it as standing head and shoulders above anything else produced by that group.
I'd probably also disagree with basing greatness on impact, because it's so closely linked to popularity and/or critical success. For instance, the Beatles' psychadelic turn (though incredibly influential) would have meant nothing if they hadn't already had the fan base to spread it out with.
The problem is that unlike many bands the Beatles haven't really been reappraised after the fact, so unlike many others their greatness hasn't been revealed later (The Stooges, Big Star) or been lauded at the time and then thrown on the trash heap of history (Fleetwood Mac- what was that all about?). It's difficult to base their greatness on their impact today precisely because it's been constantly hammered into our heads for the past 40 years.
That said, from their era the Beatles are not the most clever of lyricists (Smokey Robinson, Bob Dylan), nor the best produced (Pet Sounds, Anything by Phil Spector), nor the most emotionally riveting (Otis Redding, Aretha Franklin), nor produced a single consistent-quality album (Pet Sounds again, The Velvet Underground and Nico, The Kinks are the Village Green Preservation Society), nor the most poppy material (Girl groups, Motown most especially), nor the most rocking (Garage Rock groups like The Sonics, plus The Stones and The Yardbirds). They've always come across as rather unengaging to me, none of their material has made me sit up and be riveted.
Basing greatness on popularity is very dubious. As is critical success at the time. Certainly Pet Sounds was blasted critically and sold the lowest of any Beach Boys album to that date, yet today we see it as standing head and shoulders above anything else produced by that group.
I'd probably also disagree with basing greatness on impact, because it's so closely linked to popularity and/or critical success. For instance, the Beatles' psychadelic turn (though incredibly influential) would have meant nothing if they hadn't already had the fan base to spread it out with.
The problem is that unlike many bands the Beatles haven't really been reappraised after the fact, so unlike many others their greatness hasn't been revealed later (The Stooges, Big Star) or been lauded at the time and then thrown on the trash heap of history (Fleetwood Mac- what was that all about?). It's difficult to base their greatness on their impact today precisely because it's been constantly hammered into our heads for the past 40 years.
That said, from their era the Beatles are not the most clever of lyricists (Smokey Robinson, Bob Dylan), nor the best produced (Pet Sounds, Anything by Phil Spector), nor the most emotionally riveting (Otis Redding, Aretha Franklin), nor produced a single consistent-quality album (Pet Sounds again, The Velvet Underground and Nico, The Kinks are the Village Green Preservation Society), nor the most poppy material (Girl groups, Motown most especially), nor the most rocking (Garage Rock groups like The Sonics, plus The Stones and The Yardbirds). They've always come across as rather unengaging to me, none of their material has made me sit up and be riveted.
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