Chemical Weapons found in Iraq

[PLATO]

Originally posted by Mordoch

Actually that's extremely questionable. I'll have to check what's the deal with mustard gas, but for many chemical munitions, they are no longer usable after they have been mixed inside shells for too long. I'm curious if there is even enough intact chemical agents for the weapons to even be that dangerous. It certainly sounds highly questionable if they at all usable. If they have been burried over 10 years, there is a legitimate question of whether Saddam even knew about them or if they had been burried and forgotten. In the second case, the discovery is rather meaningless.

Of course the fact that the Iraqi's were known as the most meticulous record keepers since the Nazi's would sure lead credence to the fact they they didn't know they were there or had "forgotten" about them.

[RGBVideo]

36 mortar rounds with mustard gas? I have no experience from the army, but my guess is that some officer just forgot them into somewhere and they were buried during a sandstorm.

Some details and pictures from the shells would help.

[Colonâ„¢]

I posted a link above, with pictures.

[Patroklos]

Perhaps normal mortar rouns, but something with chemical warheads, even int he Iraqi military, would have had close accountability.

Why is that people that have something to hide alwasy do the best job of recording it?

[RGBVideo]

I posted a link above, with pictures.

Thank you.

Check out the quality. Is someone claiming that they're still in an condition where operating them could be possible?

[Verto]

Excerpts from the news articles:

Four different types of instrument were used on three of the mortar rounds, the army said in its statement, adding that 100 more rounds could be buried at the site.

Blister gas, an illegal weapon which ousted Iraqi leader Saddam Hussein said he had destroyed, was extensively used against the Iranians during the 1980-1988 Iran-Iraq war.

[Patroklos]

Just becasue the Iraqis have bad storage doesn't mean they forgot them. They may have thought they would be okay. I don't think that is the case though, obviously bloched hidding attempt. Well maybe not, as the 90's inspectors did miss them.

[Chemical Ollie]

Save gas - fart in a jar!

Swedish fishermen get ancient objects like these in their nets once in a while, and land them just kilometers away from where I sit now. We don't invade Germany or UK just because of it. US shouldn't get to horny either.

[rev]

Actually, the very shells in question were declared to UN inspectors.

Following the imposition of anti-WMD rules on Iraq by the UN and international community, Hussein's dictatorship was able to provide documentation on the destruction of most of these Mustard Gas shells. But because it had poor documentation on how many shells it used against Iran and where remaining caches were, Iraq had to declare the weapons as missing.

So, Iraq had told the world the weapons existed. Not exactly secret. The weapons were merely lost, though I'm sure some review of millions of documents gave the Danes reason to suspect the weapons might be where they were. UN Inspectors probably would have stumbled over it eventually, too.

And why did the Danes find it? Because the Bush administration has pulled most of its analysts and workers from Kay's weapons-searching team (which is the reason Kay is giving for resigning from his position, even though his final report to the Senate has not yet been finished). Clearly this administration has reason to believe its past claims have more or less been proven wrong.

[RGBVideo]

Okay, another question: The prime reason for the attack was originally the presented 'fact' that Iraq could launch a significant WMD-attack against the 'free world'. How on earth would Iraq be able to do that with three dozens of obsolote (sp) mortar shells, originally ideal for defending against human wave -attacks? Launch shells against United States with a thirty-kilometer long mortar funded by UK?

Actually, the very shells in question were declared to UN inspectors.

Following the imposition of anti-WMD rules on Iraq by the UN and international community, Hussein's dictatorship was able to provide documentation on the destruction of most of these Mustard Gas shells. But because it had poor documentation on how many shells it used against Iran and where remaining caches were, Iraq had to declare the weapons as missing.

So, Iraq had told the world the weapons existed. Not exactly secret. The weapons were merely lost, though I'm sure some review of millions of documents gave the Danes reason to suspect the weapons might be where they were. UN Inspectors probably would have stumbled over it eventually, too.

And why did the Danes find it? Because the Bush administration has pulled most of its analysts and workers from Kay's weapons-searching team (which is the reason Kay is giving for resigning from his position, even though his final report to the Senate has not yet been finished). Clearly this administration has reason to believe its past claims have more or less been proven wrong.

Could you find a link quickly for use too lazy to search for it ourselves?

[PLATO]

Originally posted by VJ

Check out the quality. Is someone claiming that they're still in an condition where operating them could be possible?

Not that I've seen.

So the liberal line changes from "See! He didn't have them!" to "So what that he had them! He couldn't use them!"

People are ridiculous.

[PLATO]

Originally posted by VJ
Okay, another question: The prime reason for the attack was originally the presented 'fact' that Iraq could launch a significant WMD-attack against the 'free world'. How on earth would Iraq be able to do that with three dozens of obsolote (sp) mortar shells, originally ideal for defending against human wave -attacks? Launch shells against United States with a thirty-kilometer long mortar funded by UK?

Yeah, it took 8 months to find these. That must be all they "forgot" about right?

[GePap]

Originally posted by Patroklos
Just becasue the Iraqis have bad storage doesn't mean they forgot them. They may have thought they would be okay. I don't think that is the case though, obviously bloched hidding attempt. Well maybe not, as the 90's inspectors did miss them.

Maybe the inspectors "missed them" becuase they were burried before they ever got to Iraq- and no, the inspectors were not going to dig along every road in Iraq looking for burried shells.

There is a reason I brought up those Japanese WW2 chemical shells that when unburried made some Chinese workers sick- becuase in wartime things get lost, or some guy onthe field says: screw it, get rid of these things- dump it on that didtch and burry them. The shells in that picture look heavily corroded and useless as shells again.

[PLATO]

Originally posted by rev
Actually, the very shells in question were declared to UN inspectors.

Following the imposition of anti-WMD rules on Iraq by the UN and international community, Hussein's dictatorship was able to provide documentation on the destruction of most of these Mustard Gas shells. But because it had poor documentation on how many shells it used against Iran and where remaining caches were, Iraq had to declare the weapons as missing.

So, Iraq had told the world the weapons existed. Not exactly secret. The weapons were merely lost, though I'm sure some review of millions of documents gave the Danes reason to suspect the weapons might be where they were. UN Inspectors probably would have stumbled over it eventually, too.

And why did the Danes find it? Because the Bush administration has pulled most of its analysts and workers from Kay's weapons-searching team (which is the reason Kay is giving for resigning from his position, even though his final report to the Senate has not yet been finished). Clearly this administration has reason to believe its past claims have more or less been proven wrong.

"Uh Yeah...those others are uh... MISSING!...Yes, Yes, that's it!"

"The Americans are no where near our Capital!"

Okay, the Iraqi's said that...guess we should trust them.

[GePap]

Originally posted by PLATO


Not that I've seen.

So the liberal line changes from "See! He didn't have them!" to "So what that he had them! He couldn't use them!"

People are ridiculous.

Is there a difference between shells that con't be used becuase they don;t exist and shells that can;t be used becuase they are left corroding under the sand for a decade? The part that maters is "can;t be used", as opposed to "THEY WILL GIVE THEM TO OSAMA, AND CAN LAUNCH THEM IN 45 MINUTES!!!" Do these look ready to use in 45 minutes?