Humiliating" the Arabs? And if so... so what?

[Gatekeeper]

Deleted, 'cause I simply don't ****ING care anymore.

[MrFun]

Originally posted by Gatekeeper

Good God. If I am the only sane person left, this world is in even more trouble than I thought.

Gatekeeper

You got a lot of helium that has inflated that ego of yours, huh?

[Gatekeeper]

Y'know, screw it ...

[Patroklos]

Sorry paiktis22 , I didn't pick out that you were playing devils advocate.

I think it will be a cold day in hell before we make up for how much this is going to cost, especially to also make the killing that people think we are.

And let me ask you this, If an American company makes money out of building a power plant in Tikrit, who profits? I suspect someone other (Iraqis? nooooo) than the company, especially since the money used to pay for it is most likely American in origin so in reality there is only one person who made a net profit.

However, just so people know the money payments for these things don't arrive in a manilla envelopes in dirty nonsequential bills. The money is company profits, and for the most part redistributed to the shareholders (minus capital reinvestment) for profit for whoever invested. But I suppose this is evil and we should run buisness like the noncapitalist societies. That way nobody could make profit and we would all be equal, albiet equally poor.

So don't be pissed because picked the wrong investments.

-Pat

[orange]

Because the issue that you're dismissing with "So what?" has been responsible for the rise of ultra-reactionary religious and xenophobic movements in the Middle East, you fucking moron

[Gatekeeper]

I hope Saddam's trial humiliates the entire Arab *and* Western world.

[Gatekeeper]

I hope every single ****ing leader in the Arab *and* Western world (let's not forget the United Nations, either) from the time of the Cold War forward has to eat humble pie ... 'cause once Saddam's on trial, you can bet skeletons are gonna come out of the closet.

There will be very few Arab and Western nations able to claim innocence once Saddam's on trial — after all, he sure as hell didn't just rise to power in a vaccuum, nor sustain his power in a vaccuum. The bastard had help.

Arabs, Americans and Europeans ... we're going to find out that our leaders aren't so untouchable after all.

Hmm. Maybe Saddam will be conveniently killed before the trial comes to pass ...

[Gatekeeper]

Break out the popcorn, kids. 2004 is going to be an interesting year. We haven't had anything like this since the Nuremburg Trials after WW II ... and, no, Slobodan Milosevic doesn't count. Saddam is on a scale beyond that would-be tyrant.

Gatekeeper

[Gatekeeper]

There's how I really feel, MrFun. Having fun yet?

[Gatekeeper]

And one-dimensional posters/DLs like Tripledoc aren't helping my mood any ...

[Lancer]

Iraqis dancing in the streets for joy over the actions of a republican administration is not politicly correct, so the left finds something to ***** about.

[Inverse Icarus]

Originally posted by skywalker
I was wondering, do Muslims believe in the seven deadly sins? If so, humility is good for them

they have "the five pillars of islam".

1. to make Shahadataan (declaration of faith)
2. to establish Salaah (formal prayer)
3. to give Zakaah (charity)
4. to make Sawm (fasting in the month of Ramadaan)
5. to perform Hajj (pilgrimage to the Ka'bah).

thats all i can remember from my world history class 4 years ago, and a quickie google.

[Fake Boris]

Patroklos,

I wonder if someday some Americans will get to understand.

EUROPEAN PACIFISTS ARE NOT EUROPEAN GOVERNMENT.
America is worse than France because more power=more ways to abuse it. At a time when France was more powerful, it was worse than America. That's how human history has been working for 5000 years.

How many times will we have to repeat: no one claims any morale high ground. All governments in the world only protect their own interest. In the case of Iraq, it happened that commercial interests went along with popular opinion.
So if the French population is against the war and so are French bankers who want their money back, Chirac won't irate both segments by going to war. That is obvious.

So when you say "European pacifists will make money", that was false. Businesses will make money. Whether they are American or European doesn't matter. American businesses wanted the war because it was good for them, in the same way French and Russian businesses didn't want it because it was bad for them. In this particular case, it is also true that Iraq owes money directly to the French and Russian goverments. They want their money back. So does the US when similar situations arise in other countries; they are not known to be keen on cancelling foreign debts.

I didn't know I was defending anyone or any country. The only stance I will adopt is one of the humanist- which more often than not lies opposite to the patriot's.

You show utter stupidity in your depiction of colonization. Pop transfers is probably the most irrelevant factor in this.
Modern colonization is about Government puppeting and Economic vassalization. This is what Japan did with Korea and Manchukuo in in the first half of the 20th century. This is what America has done in Latin America. This is what the Soviet Union had done with the Warsaw Pact. Organisations such as the WTC, controlled by the US and its puppets, are crucial in this matter. They value free-trade over nations self-determination. Of course, those unwilling to join it face themselves to economic sanctions even worse than the resulting lack of sovereignty. The last WTC summit was aborted by thirld world countries because of the rich countries' lack of cooperation.

Yes, Europe has been a colonial power. However:
-history is not about moral judgments. especially when those who made it are long dead. What does Pizarro have to do with today's Spain? or Lasalle with today's France?
Who cares what my grand-grand-grand-grand-father did at Versailles? (from a moral point of view, that is)
-Politics, however, are. Because we are voters and these events are going on right now.

As has always been the case, you are trying to apply the modified civilized world that your societies have crafted for you to the raw real world that now exists in Iraq and in that world; people will die, infrastructure will be destroyed, wars are nessecary, no war is ever about truly unselfish causes

Looks like a good definition of neo-colonialism to me.

[Patroklos]

Uncle Boris,

I would respond to you except you have to make some sense so I have something to go with, though I have to agree with your second paragraph.

As to your fists, well then I guess no coutry should ever try and become something becasue in your view it just makes them evil. You are right, we do you the power to do some really evil stuff. The problem with your theory is we aren't. I will repeat that. WE ARE NOT. Do you think the left is attacking us becasue are wrong oh niave one. Of course not, they are doing it becaues they have to oppose anything the right does. If we had done the exact opposite they would be *****ing the same way they are now because it is what they have to do.

Here is a warning from me to all the third world, don't ever make something of yourselves. As soon as you do you will fit into Boris's idiotic if-you-have-the-physical-capacity-to-do-evil-then-you-are cicular arguementl. I happen to think that the more poweful you are you might be able do some good with it as well, but you know I guess I should just take lok at things from one direction like you.

-Pat

[Kuciwalker]

Oncle Boris, you forget that, while more power = more ability to do evil, more power = more ability to do good, too.