What's the difference between fascism and nationalism?

[Sandman]

Originally posted by Ned
Sandman, what we all can agree on is that nobody likes the Fascists. They are anathema to both the left and right. Since they start from a premise that individual is subordinate to the state, they have nothing in common with the current right-wing represented by individualismist Republicans and freedomist Libertarians.

However, I see much in common with their philosophy in the left that seems to subordinate individual rights for the "greater good" of society. This is equivalent to the fascist formula.

The left and fascists have very different ideas about what individual rights are (and who they apply to), and what the greater good actually is. I could just as easily say that the right likes to subordinate individual rights (such as the right to strike, the right to free univerisity education, the right to healthcare) for the 'greater good' of the market.

Edited for grammar.

[Ned]

Sandman, True. But I contend that once you establish the principle that individual rights are suborndinate to the "national" good as defined by those in power, you ineluctably end up with a single-party police state if not totalitarianism. It's a slippery slope.

[Sandman]

That's not suggested in any way by history. Plenty of societies have robust, century-old welfare states and have not become totalitarian.

The national good is often served by individual rights, especially if those in power are elected by the people themselves. Free healthcare for all serves the nation by keeping the population healthy and productive, whilst also satisfying the individual right to be healthy. State-provided healthcare is also more efficient.

Fascism, being undemocratic to start with, chooses different priorities which are usually worse for individuals but better for the national good. Choices like scapegoating minorities, building up the military, making women baby-factories and banning free speech.

[JCG]

The difference(s) has already been explained by quite a large number of people...just adding that the term fascism/fascist is horribly misused to this very day by *guess what side of the political spectrum*.

(and yeah, the word communism has also been misused a lot...but, ironically, not just by their opponents but also by a huge number of people/movements that have claimed the title of "communist" for themselves...and many people, of course, believe them).

[Ned]

I would argue, Sandman, that any society that allows the people by their votes to change their government has not yet subordinated the individual to the state even though that maybe the ultimate objective of one of the political parties. Both communism and fascism are undemocratic in philosophy and practice. They can and do subordinate individual rights to the higher purpose of the state. It is in these principles that the two philosophies begin their common path toward totalitarianism.

[Tripledoc]

Georgie boy Bush in a leatherjacket is vistiting his favourite bar. The place where he likes to hang out.

Oh kill them, Oh kill them
My god the spermificator will do do it.
Oh kill them, Oh kill them.
I am just so fantastic and orgiastic
My supererior semen will grant them admitance
To the Kingdom of God, and forever
I am the Superman of men on my demand
My star wars project, oh give a hand
Puke
Oh puke
Puke,puke,puke and PUUUUUUUKE
And hang yourself in your own necktie. Oh yeaaaaaaah

(a little poetic licence on 'Relax', if you don't mind)

What can you say. Are we down and dirty or clean and stuffy?

Did you see all those young boys running out from the White House? Tasty! Tasty!

I'm Cheney. Where am I?
My *** is kinda tasty (arghhhhh)
I'm Cheny. Where am I?
****ing up the world.
****ing up the world

And a big ****ing heil hitler to all you mother****ers!

Peace.