Quo Vadis Space Shuttle

[Chemical Ollie]

What if the 80 billion dollars was spent on NASA instead of Saddam?

[Eli]

Originally posted by Olaf HÃ¥rfagre
What if the 80 billion dollars was spent on NASA instead of Saddam?

I guess that in this case about 10 years from now our cars would've used shuttle fuel due to the lack of oil.

[PLATO]

Originally posted by Olaf HÃ¥rfagre
What if the 80 billion dollars was spent on NASA instead of Saddam?

Then my next vacation would be at The Earthview Hotel in Luna City

[Ned]

Actually, the Shuttle may never fly again. The report and a supplemental report called for fixing the foam issue as well as a number of other issues. The foam issue has been there since the beginning and there appears to be no known solution except for a redesign that would eliminate the foam itself. Such a redisign could doom the Shuttle.

As to the "whistle-blower issue," the report makes it clear that no one in the ranks was willing to press the photo issue after they had learned that Ham had cut off the first request. It was quite apparent to even the casual reader of the report that Ham was a monster.

[Ned]

Congress is going to conduct a thorough review. Everything appears to be on the table. The possibility of ending America's involvement in manned space exploration is being openly discussed.

http://www.nytimes.com/2003/08/28/national/nationalspecial/28POLI.html?th

[Arrian]

quote:
If you pushed an issue before in NASA that management decided wasn't an "issue", you got fired. And blacklisted. No whistle blowing tolerated. Anyone pushing an issue after it was "downed" was considered a candidate for early retirement. Anyone that made the mistake if going public would find the weight of the government descending on them. That's how NASA worked.


All the NASA leaders should be beheaded for this.

Yeah, that's really ****ing bad.

Having said that, even with the political bull**** that goes on, NASA's record really isn't that bad. I know that doesn't provide much comfort to the families of the astronauts lost, but it's true. Things can always be improved. I hope they are. I hope NASA gets more money. I hope they get better management. I hope they figure out that the shuttle needs to be replaced because their just a *bit* past their expected lifespans.

I hope.

-Arrian

[Rogan Josh]

It's time to shut NASA down, and with the money saved build a nice BIG particle collider.

[MrFun]

Originally posted by Giant_Squid
"Insisting on perfect safety is for people who don't have the balls to live in the real world."
— Mary Shafer, NASA Ames Dryden

This is going to sound highly callous and politically incorrect, but so be it.
NASA deals with stuff that is inherently unbelievably dangerous. You've probably heard the crazy statistics like if they're off by a tenth of a degree or a tenth of a second or whatever, the shuttle burns up and everyone dies, how there are 15 million different components in the shuttle and if even one of them malfunctions the shuttle burns up and everyone dies, how if they get their speed wrong by a single percent the shuttle burns up and everyone dies, et cetera. Contrary to the popular saying, this IS rocket science, and it's probably the most complex, difficult, and advanced thing going on in the world today.

That being said, one miss every fifteen years is a pretty good safety record, especially if you factor in that this includes over a hundred flights, all kinds of different missions, and constant changes of procedure. It is unfortunate that people died, but they became astronauts in the knowledge that they were putting their lives on the line.

Certainly continue the investigation into what went wrong and make sure to fix it. Certainly fire the people responsible and cancel any contracts with the companies responsible. Certainly up safety precautions where it is discovered they were too lax. But to whine about how NASA has a culture of inattention to safety or are bumbling incompetents or just don't care about people's lives or have an awful track record seems to me to be comparable to the letter-writer who said of the recent New York blackout "How many times do these people have to prove their inability to do their job before something gets done?", despite the fact that it was the first such blackout in thirty years. Give these guys a break. And while you're at it, give them a budget so that they've got something to work with.

I agree with you on this one.

[chequita guevara]

Re: Quo Vadis Space Shuttle

Originally posted by Ned
I am surprised there is no thread on the Shuttle Report. But it is devestating to NASA. The Columbia disaster happened because NASA ignored safety in favor of cost and schedules. They did not learn the lessor of Challenger.

Actually they did learn, and then the Republicans cut their funding to the bone.

[Arrian]

Somebody was bound to come along and blame it one of the parties.

Che wins the prize.

I don't think either party has a shining record here.

-Arrian

[Sandman]

Hmm. What's the status of orbital lifts these days?

[chequita guevara]

Originally posted by Arrian
Somebody was bound to come along and blame it one of the parties.

Che wins the prize.

I don't think either party has a shining record here.

-Arrian

While I agree with you, it is also true that the Republicans decided to make deep cuts in NASA's funding. It's an old stratgey, cut the department's funding but don't reduce it's responsibilities, then when it can't succeed because of lack of resources, point out how "inefficient" government is and outsource to your lobbyists. That's when NASA came up with the smaller, smarter, faster plan, and we all know how that went.

I don't understand why everyone is so freakin outraged. This is exploration. It is inherently dangerous. How many jet pilots died testing jets? How many pilots died trying to test flight in the first place? How many explores were lost at sea? Three fatal accidents in 40 years of American manned space flights isn't that bad a record. And hell, more people die no the roads of America every day, where's the outrage?

[Arrian]

don't understand why everyone is so freakin outraged. This is exploration. It is inherently dangerous. How many jet pilots died testing jets? How many pilots died trying to test flight in the first place? How many explores were lost at sea? Three fatal accidents in 40 years of American manned space flights isn't that bad a record.

I agree.

Incidentally, I think there would be less outrage if the goal struck the public as "grand" or "noble" - such as going for Mars. Since shuttle missions to low Earth orbit aren't sexy, the public isn't as willing to accept failure. Or something like that.

As for your comments on Republican tactics... I'm sure there is something to that (from a strategic PoV, it's pretty smart - Machiavellian, even). I'm also sure there are dirty tricks used by the Democrats.

-Arrian

[chequita guevara]

Originally posted by Arrian
I'm also sure there are dirty tricks used by the Democrats.

-Arrian

Dirty tricks require intelligence and the backbone to be evil. The Dem's have neither.

[Arrian]