What if thread #1: What if the US had used the Bomb in Europe during WW2?

[JohnT]

February 12th, 1945: General Dwight Eisenhower hurredly sends the following communication to the Head of the RAF, Arthur Harris:

"I have been ordered by President Roosevelt to fully delay, for an indefinite period, tomorrow's planned bombing of Dresden. Have your men stand down and await further instructions."

Air Marshall Harris was furious, but was partially mollified when, reassured that this decision was due to no bad reflection on his work, he was informed that there were other plans for the city of Dresden "if this war drags on too long."

March 1st, 1945: The world is stunned to learn of the accidental death of the USSR's Marshall Zhukov early last week, due, not to the dangers of war, but to a simple accident of falling down the stairs in the town of ... Taking advantage of the Soviets confusion, Germany began a ferocious counterattack, though nobody truly expected it to do more than delay the inevitable for a few months - if at that. Unfortunately for the city of Dresden, Germany got their delay.

September 2nd, 1945: The third atomic warhead used in WW2 went off today in Dresden Germany, causing the swift end of German resistance. The Americans announcement that such a disaster was coming "saved" over 500,000 lives so that the loss was "only" 75,000. The remnants of the German government officially surrendered on September 3rd, just hours after they murdered Hitler.

Assume that the cold war conditions remained the same (i.e., Berlin was still divided as was Germany (but do you think that Dresden would now be a W. Germany city?))

What would be the short and long-term effects of such an action?

[JohnT]

Btw, it is my intention of doing a series of "What if" threads, starting the next one when the current one dies out. If you have any suggestions, feel free to post them.

[DanielXY]

There would be another good reason to get hyped for anti-amercanism in germany?

[DinoDoc]

Would we have enough nukes to bomb Japan if we used them on Germany?

[JohnT]

The scenario calls for just one nuke on Germany, so at the worst, just one would've been dropped on Japan and one on Germany. However, the US was busy producing more bombs and it was only a matter of time before the third A-bomb was produced.

Evidence for third bombs' existence: http://www.danford.net/third.htm

Dresden during 1945: http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/2WWdresden.htm

[The Andy-Man]

if it was 1945 dresden, i can't see mucg being there to be bombed.

[Eli]

Dino :
The Dresden bomb was the third, after the Japanese bombings. "September 2nd, 1945: The third atomic warhead used in WW2 went off today in Dresden Germany". Though IIRC the US had only 3 bombs at that time, one blew up during the Trinity test and 2 others in Japan.

[JohnT]

However, for the scenario's sake, assume that Japan surrendered "on schedule" and that the US had the third bomb ready. Since, irl, we didn't a-bomb Dresden, were safe in hypothesizing that there was a third bomb.

Edit: I posted two links above for Andy Man and Dino. Dresden was a relatively untouched city in 1945, with over tens of thousands refugees packed in a city that already housed 600,000. And there is plenty of evidence that America could've had a third bomb in Europe by September 2nd, easily.

[Sandman]

Short-term: fanatical Nazi resistors would have had more time to prepare for a protracted guerilla campaign. The Germans may have developed more advanced technology in the intervening period, as well as dedicated kamikaze aircraft. The scramble for German technology and scientists would have been more complicated, rather than the first-come first-served situation which arose.

The Soviets would never have invaded Manchuria, so the Japanese may have been less willing to surrender. Given the presumed Soviet casualties in the German counterattack, Korea may not have been divided.

India, Pakistan and Israel would have come into existence a bit later, with possibly all of them intensifying resistance/terrorism against the British.

American power would be amplified and Soviet would be diminished, since a longer war would probably meant an even higher level of production from America, but more casualties for the Soviets.

[Sava]

Wasn't Dresden all but destroyed by the US firebombing of civilians?

[SlowwHand]

We'd have still messed up and liberated France, again.

[Sava]

I think Sloww has an inferiority complex in regards to France.

[SlowwHand]

Yeah. That's it.

[Panag]

Originally posted by Eli
Dino :
The Dresden bomb was the third, after the Japanese bombings. "September 2nd, 1945: The third atomic warhead used in WW2 went off today in Dresden Germany". Though IIRC the US had only 3 bombs at that time, one blew up during the Trinity test and 2 others in Japan.

hi ,

number 4 and 5 where rolling down the line , ......

have a nice day

[Stefu]

Btw, it is my intention of doing a series of "What if" threads, starting the next one when the current one dies out. If you have any suggestions, feel free to post them.

Mmm. I'd like a discussion on what would have happened if Kuomintang had defeated the communists in China in late forties.

Other interesting ones include France hanging on to it's North American holdings (Canada and Louisiana) past 1700s, four more years of Bush I in 1992, not to forget the Mongols raiding Western Europe. Persians conquering Greece after winning in Salamis would be nice, too.