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Who exactly made Belgium the judge of all the earth?

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  • Who exactly made Belgium the judge of all the earth?

    BRUSSELS, April 29 (Reuters) - A Belgian lawyer said on Tuesday he would file a lawsuit against General Tommy Franks, commander of U.S. forces in Iraq, despite a warning from Washington against politically-motivated legal cases.

    Lawyer Jan Fermon told Reuters he would file the lawsuit in a Brussels court next month on behalf of 19 Iraqis whom he described as victims of U.S. cluster bombs and alleged U.S. attacks on ambulances and civilians.

    The case is based on evidence, including videotaped testimony, gathered by a group of Belgian doctors working in Baghdad, Fermon said.

    The U.S. State Department on Monday urged Belgium to be diligent in preventing the abuse for "political ends" of a Belgian law giving the country's courts power to try foreigners for serious human rights crimes. Spokesman Richard Boucher said Washington believed lawyers were planning to file a suit against Franks.

    "I think either the U.S. State Department has nothing to hide, in which case it's very important for them to have an independent inquiry -- and why can't it be a Belgian magistrate -- or they have something to hide and that's why they are threatening Belgium," Fermon said.

    He added that Franks, as commander of the U.S.-led war that toppled Iraqi leader Saddam Hussein, bore responsibility for the actions of his troops.

    "If the Belgian law allowed me to also point out people who are politically responsible, I'd do it, but of course I can't because they are protected by (diplomatic) immunity," Fermon said. He did not give any names.

    An official working for the legal department of the Belgian Foreign Ministry said it was too early to comment on the action.

    TEST CASE

    The lawsuit will be a test case for Belgium's universal jurisdiction law which was recently revamped in a bid to stem a flood of cases deemed politically and diplomatically sensitive.

    Legal moves against Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon and former U.S. President George Bush prompted criticism from Belgian Foreign Minister Louis Michel, who said it was not up to Belgium to judge them.

    The reformed law allows Belgium to pass certain war crimes cases to other countries -- raising the possibility it will eventually rid itself of a file against Sharon over the 1982 massacre of Palestinians at refugee camps in Beirut by Israeli-backed Lebanese militiamen. Sharon was defence minister at the time.

    The changes to the law also allow the judiciary to reject complaints filed by plaintiffs who are not Belgian citizens or who have lived in Belgium for less than three years.

    Where the victim or alleged perpetrator is not Belgian and the alleged crime was not committed in Belgium, a federal prosecutor would be able to decide whether to hand over a case to an investigating magistrate.

    "Indeed it will be a test case. It will show whether the Belgian federal prosecutor will admit an independent inquiry without any political considerations," said Fermon.

    ============================

    Yea right. Tommy Franks is going to go to Brussels to beg for mercy from the eminent court of supreme justice.

  • #2
    Oops. I just noticed that they were discussing this on DinoDoc's thread. You all can ignore this one...

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    • #3
      DinoDoc doesn't want us discussing this in his thread. Might as well move the discussion over here.
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      • #4
        Idiot law suits like this one are a text book example of why the U.S. should stone wall the EU's attempt to create a world court. If given any power it will degenerate into a politically motivated circus.
        Try http://wordforge.net/index.php for discussion and debate.

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        • #5
          Good deal. This is NOT a picture of Tommy Franks:

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          • #6
            Originally posted by Oerdin
            Idiot law suits like this one are a text book example of why the U.S. should stone wall the EU's attempt to create a world court. If given any power it will degenerate into a politically motivated circus.
            Exactly. They are making the case for us. I think they have overplayed their hand on this one.

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            • #7
              As I said in the other thread, are people really surprised that the US doesn't want to join the ICC when people in the rest of the world treat war crimes as a vehicle to score political points with?
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              • #8
                Most Americans have a great deal of confidience that their court system will toss out the B.S. law suits and will make all of its decisions based up on the law instead of on a proticular judges bais or political beliefs. We do not have any close to a similar amount of confidience in the courts of nearly all of the world's countries much less a nebulous "World Court".
                Try http://wordforge.net/index.php for discussion and debate.

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                • #9
                  Why should the US be immune to war crimes laws while expecting the rest of the world to abide by them. Franks is a war criminal who has waged an aggressive war. People were hanged at Nuremburg for much less.
                  http://monkspider.blogspot.com/

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                  • #10
                    Sorry to interrupt the self-righteous anti-ICC fest, but...

                    This Belgian law allows Belgian citizens to file a case. Belgium being not a totalitarian country, the State is not responsible for the behaviour of individual citizens or groups.
                    In the Article, Belgian Foreign Minister criticizes the abuses that have been done on this law, and the parliament has attempted to limit its range to prevent abuses.

                    I'm not very fond of the self-righteousness of this Belgian "universal" law, because I don't think it is up to an individual country to judge war crimes or crimes against humanity, but please notice this initiative does not come from the Belgian government. It is an abuse made by citizens.

                    Had the US a law that allowed citizens to sue generals for war crimes, you can be sure some leftist organization would have sued Franks, Bush, Rummie, and I don't-know-who already. Because they try to score political points this way too.

                    Except if Belgium suddenly has an interest in alienating the US definitely, the case has no chance to pass. Especially since an arrest request issued by Belgium would force other EU countries to arrest Franks if he goes on their territory (I think)
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                    • #11
                      Had the US a law that allowed citizens to sue generals for war crimes, you can be sure some leftist organization would have sued Franks, Bush, Rummie, and I don't-know-who already. Because they try to score political points this way too.


                      Very true. The difference is that moronic leftist views, while present in America, aren't nearly as mainstream as they are in Europe and other places. America doesn't trust that the international community (and by extension the ICC) will be politically neutral in war crimes cases and incidents like this one just reinforce those fears.

                      It's too bad, really. The ICC could be a great thing if it would concentrate on the real war criminals in the world. Maybe it can prove itself in the future and have the US get on-board at a later date.
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                      • #12
                        Lawyer Jan Fermon told Reuters he would file the lawsuit in a Brussels court next month on behalf of 19 Iraqis whom he described as victims of U.S. cluster bombs and alleged U.S. attacks on ambulances and civilians.
                        OH MY GOD!!! You mean to tell me that innocent people were killed during a WAR??? Thats never happened before, this Tommy Franks is obviously a monster!!!

                        get real

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                        • #13
                          "People were hanged at Nuremburg for much less."
                          Actually, you're wrong.
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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Lincoln


                            Exactly. They are making the case for us. I think they have overplayed their hand on this one.
                            I remember people like Rah, who were favorably disposed to the ICC and then turned against it when hearing all the little Polyteenies who wanted to try Kissinger and such. This kind of thing just shows clearly what a joke the ICC would be.

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                            • #15
                              Re: Who exactly made Belgium the judge of all the earth?

                              Belgium is the heart of Europe

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