CtP2 Civilizations

[Joseph]

Stratesford

Hi. I wasn't trying to forget the Mayan, Aztecs, or Incas. I though they had been assimilate by Mexico, Guatemala, Honduras, Colombia, Ecuador, and Peru. Question, how many pure blood Mayan, Aztecs, Incas survive today.

Last night on the History Channel, they had the story of the Norwegian who sail the raft Kok Tike from Peru to French Polynesia in 1948 to prove that Indians from Peru could have made it a few thousand years ago (the Statues of Easter Island. The Polynesia did get there until the 5th Century. The statues are much older), then he later (1962) went Africa and sail a reed boat from Tunisia to Barbados to prove that maybe the Egyptian came to Mexico a few thousand years ago. As you know there are some similarity between the Pyramids of Egypt and Mexico. Do we know what the early Egyptian look like? The Arabs overran Egypt in the Seven or Eighth Century.

------------------

[This message has been edited by Joseph (edited October 17, 2000).]

[Stratesford]

According to the census of 1990 there are about 5 million mayans in mexico alone and 500,000 nahuatls(aztecs)

I don't think the aztecs or mayans got their ideas from the egyptians. The angle of an aztec pyramid is usually 34 degrees and plus the aztecs built their monuments for one reason and the mayans for another an the egyptians for another. There is proof though that the egyptians had some contact with america since tabbaco,weed,cocoa and peyote(those egyptians were drugees!) have been found at the burial sites

[Chris Horscroft]

The easiest way to deal with most of these issues is to allow the player to choose which computer civilisations he will compete against. Then anyone who doesn't like particular country names appearing in the civilisation list can live happily ever after.

Like the ancient and modern names idea, and suggest that the player be able to select when a change civ name prompt will come up. At change of government type, at conquest of enemy civilisation, at change of era. Any others?

[Bali]

Choosing your adversaries is definitely needed. I may have an interest for a particular region of the world and fighting against neighbours makes much more sence. I also do not like Cubans, but not because of drugs. I play Indian, and it looks weird for ancient Indians to fight against Cubans and Nicaraguans. I want to beat Persians, Chinese, Mongolians etc.

[fred]

They better not puck up the Canadians again!

Get the cities right!!
god dammit


OR we will throw the beer bottles at ya!!

EH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Paulypav]

I would definitely like to see the option to pick your opponents. This would allow for those of us looking for historical accuracy to pick logical countries. At the same time CTP is not just about recreating history, but considering scenarios in which two civilizations that never would have appeared in real life actually met. If I'm not mistaken it is possible to change the names of the civilizations in the code. I'm not experienced enough to try it myself, but I thought that the ability to do that was there. If that's correct you can change it yourself.

That being said it would be great if every country and civilization could be included but imagine it would get out of control and would be cumbersome (that's a lot of cities to establish for each civ).

As long as the Irish are there, I'm happy.

------------------
"In war, there is no substitute for victory."
- Douglas MacArthur

[Bartemans]

Same for me with the Dutch. We earn a place in a CIV game.

Espescially in an exploration scenario, together with the English, Portugese, French, Spanish, Italians and all the inland civs, who were wiped out by the people mentioned above.

Bye,

Bartemans
http://home.hccnet.nl/stolte.1

[Bartemans]

Oh yeah, Fred,

You didn't like the names of the Canadian cities: Same for me with the Dutch (sorry, I forgot this point).

the cities: Amsterdam, The Hague, Arnhem, Leeuwarden, Assen, Groningen etc.

All these cities are capitals of a province, except Amsterdam. But the sequence is wrong. Rotterdam should be third, Utrecht fourth, Eindhoven fifth, Groningen sixth.
However, Rotterdam, Utrecht and Eindhoven are coming up as fifteenth and so on.

Leiden comes after Leiderdorp, which is pathetic. Leiden and the missing city Delft are historic and therefor they should be in the game and NOT Ede (a very minor town, more like a village) and Breukelen (same for Ede, but then for the Dutch celeberties and other rich people)

So, programmers: A suggestion. If you would put many civs in a game (good, continue with that!) ask people on the forum WHICH citties it should have and in which sequence.

[Solver]

I would like to repeat that I mostly play my country. It would be nice if you could add/remove civs just by clicking such an option in the game, then you would be able to create any civ, even the Martians.

------------------
Solver - http://www.aok.20m.com

[Bartemans]

Solver,

EXCELLENT IDEA!!!!
I would love such an option, it would solve (how did you get that name? ) the debate on this forum!!!

Again: WOW!!!

Bye,

Bartemans
http://home.hccnet.nl/stolte.1

[Old Bear]

I love historical accuracy. In fact this chain of letters is an excellent example of why we hairless apes are busy trying to wipe each other off the face of the earth.
If you want to play only a civilization with continuity, then we all play the Chinese. EVERY other civilization has had it's ups and downs, been charged with new blood, collapsed, been reborn under another name etc.
Keep in mind this is a GAME!


------------------
The secret to life is-
there isn't any.
[This message has been edited by Old Bear (edited October 24, 2000).]

[Chris Horscroft]

Chinese civilisation has had its ups and downs too, you know.

Agree totally with Bartemans that this forum could be used to establish which cities to put on the list for each country. I hardly play the Australian civ because of the ridiculous city ordering and list (I've never heard of some of them, and live here!). The list of English cities I find difficult to justify as well, and I can't imagine that "Head Smashed In" is a real place - even in Canada!

So, NOTE FOR ACTIVISION. Please ask people what cities should be included for country-based civs. Bartemans - do you have a preferred complete list of Dutch cities? If you want to post one, I'll replace my city file to follow it... Anyone else want to contribute?

[Paulypav]

Obviously for ease of use it would be great for Activision to do things exactly as we would like. It isn't that difficult to change the city names to those that we would like, so I would rather Activision get the bugs out of the game rather than work on getting accurate city lists.

I know in CivII, you could go into the code rather easily and change the city names, I don't know if you could in CTP, but it would be nice if it was possible in CTP II.



------------------
"In war, there is no substitute for victory."
- Douglas MacArthur

[Locutus]

Yes, Paulypav, changing city names in the code is possible in CtP(II) as well, it's fairly easy in CtPI and I don't think it will be more complicated in CtPII.
In fact, I once made a (IMHO) proper list of Dutch city names (though I'm sure Bartemans, or any other Dutch guy for that matter, would have some comments about it), Nordicus even used it for one of his gigantic world maps (though that was unfortunately never released in public). If I can find it back, I could post it somewhere, though I doubt Activision really cares about such details, making the game bug-free is probably a much higher priority (and rightly so).

[Bartemans]

Chris Horscroft and all the others:

My preferred Dutch city list

1. Amsterdam
2. Rotterdam
3. Den Haag (The Hague)
4. Utrecht
5. Eindhoven
6. Groningen
7. Arnhem
8. Middelburg
9. Maastricht
10. Haarlem
11. Den Bosch
12. Zwolle
13. Leeuwarden
14. Assen
15. Lelystad
16. Enschede
17. Nijmegen
18. Leiden
19. Delft
20. Tilburg
21. Wageningen
22. Roermond
23. Venlo
24. Almere
25. Deventer
26. Kampen
27. Zutphen
28. Vlissingen
29. Apeldoorn
30. Alkmaar
31. Den Helder
32. Breda
33. Dordrecht
34. Hoorn
35. Enkhuizen


Based on: First the nation’s capital and the six largest cities. Then all the capital of the twelve provinces (except Amsterdam, Rotterdam and Eindhoven), all cities until 15 are provincial capitals.

Then other big cities (Dutch standards, of course), cities of historical importance and cities with universities. Cities like Deventer and Kampen are so called "Hanze" cities, which means they became rich by trading and trading posts (important roads went along these cities)

The sequence may not be too accurate, but I’ll work it out.

The last cities in the row come from a road-atlas, so it's not A-OK, but CERTAINLY LOTS!!!! better then the list in CTPI!

Bye,

Bartemans
http://home.hccnet.nl/stolte.1