The best of all worlds...

[Immortal Wombat]

you could message the human saying "rename your cities, the current names are sooo last century..."

[ahenobarb]

Originally posted by Lou Wigman
Just a note about the AI and forts. There's a piece of SLIC code that makes the AI build them. They're great for me to use but in the extensive playing I did with Cradle I never even once saw an AI unit in any of them. Clearly the AI doesn't know what they are.

I've noticed the same thing. There are no AI forts anywhere on the map. Has this been fixed in the interim? My version of Cradle is not the latest, it's probably 3-4 versions behind.

[Locutus]

The problem of the AI not *building* any fortresses was solved a long time ago by Martin. As far as manning them: I dunno, I've seen them do it in the last Tournament game at least... maybe in other games too, not sure. With my own strategy units in fortresses can usually be put to better use elsewhere, I just use fortresses for expanding borders myself - only occassionally for the extra defense bonus when nearby units happen to be under threat, only very occassionally. Anyway, I never ever man them permanently.

[SMIFFGIG]

Ideas, suggestions and a few small questions

I have mentioned some of these before but most of them i havent, i just wanted to sum up all my ideas i would love to see in "History of the World" mod.

DIPLOMACY


On diplomacy screen have the leaders face on the top left and the parchment where it normaly is, as originally concieved and as shown in this screenshot :

http://www.gamespy.com/asp/image.asp?/previews/november00/calltopower2/calltopower004.jpg

DIPLOMATIC REQUESTS

Add these new diplomatic requests

+Request they mass troops
+Request Invasion
+Request break agreements
+Request Nuke Reduction
+Request bio weapon reduction
+Request nano weapon reduction
+Request annual gold (as in Civ3)

These where also originally going to be used in CtP2
As i have said before i particularly like "request annual gold" and "Request they mas troops" although that may tottaly confuse the AI though it would be cool if they would ask you that too

BARBARIAN

Use the Barbarian Encampment SLIC that Pedrunn has done.
I quite like the idea of a barbarian leader and money if you killed him, furthermore will barb encampments still appear in modern times, i think this would be good if they produced terrorist or something and if the camp image could be upgraded to modern that would be cool too.

TI's

Use the bit of SLC Pedrunn also done to get airfields to look how they are supposed to on mountains


TERRAIN = DEATH

As in Civ3 although i cant remember how it worked exactly, but could you make it so that certain terrains have harmful effect upon units as a percetage chance. EG a 5% chance that if you made an army go through desert that they would die of thurst or harsh condisions, if they went through forest 5% chance they would die of disease or an army going through mountain 5% chance they die of harsh condisions etc etc of course some units would have to be ammune to these effects. AND it would be better if it applied if you just leave a unit on a potentially harmful tile for ages. 5% might be to much im not sure, cause you dont exactly want to be loosing whole armies all the time due to disease or hunger BUT it would certainly make the play think more sesibly and realisticly about which routes he took. They AI would also have to know, which might be the halter to this idea. If this idea could be implemented and well balanced i think it would be great

ABOUT WONDERS MAKING RICH RICHER

u dont like the idea of one city building all the wonders and I agree. I think to get around this you should make it so that a popup appears (say 85%) of the time after you have just built a wonder in that city and then try to build another in the same city. This would last for a certain amount of turns. Oh and the message would make it so you couldnt build anymore wonders in that city for whatever amount of turns you decide to make this event last for. It would say something like "General population refuse to set work on {wonder} as they feel it is a waste or misdirection of valuable resources" you could even go further and say it was because they wanted something else to boost food or production (same kinda thing as the city mayor does in its suggestions)

BRIBING

I also believe you should give some unconventional unit the ability to bribe enemy units. Depending on the unit type, if its obsolete and if its a vetern oh and of course the amount of units. The price will be different accoringly. Mybe a diplomat and/or spy unit could do this? Another feature, armies with great leaders in would be unbribable

UNITS


CTP1 UNITS
I assume as in MM2 there will be units from CtP1 like Hoplites (elite) and Phalanx looking very similar one using the CtP1 graphics and the other the CtP2 graphics. The old War Walker graphics and sounds CtP1 (now that is a cool unit)


PRIVATEER
If the code for the privateer could be worked out that would be very cool, use the graphics from Civ3 for the unit.

FANATIC AND PARTISAN
Will there be fanatic units for the fundematalism government (or any other governmet types that may apply) and will partisans be able to attack as in Civ2?



Thats I think it for now, im sure there will be more ideas soon but anyway im too tired to bed it is for me
Thanks for reading (if you have)

P.S. I am playing MM2 mod, latest version and I get a fault in the elite unit code when the AI get an elite unit it says something like "The mayans get elite war elephant{unit_record} due to the great understanding of {Advance_0} or some crap like that, Its not just one off its for every elite unit.

the second is the Noble in it, on the options display for the unit (bottom right on GUI) it has the normal (establish embassy, hold reception) etc but has three extra ones saying i think its "Build detecter" "Build Airbase" and build "fortification", im hoping this is just an error in MM2 and not in the general way the noble has bn made (thinking of when it goes into HotW mod. Thats if it will be in there (i hope)

SMIFFGIG

[Locutus]

Re: Ideas, suggestions and a few small questions

Thanks for your ideas, SMIFFGIG!

Originally posted by SMIFFGIG's
DIPLOMACY

This is a LOT of work and at least some of it would quite probably require changes to the source code of the game. At least initially I'll mostly rely on others for diplomacy (although of course with my new list of Civs I will need new backgrounds for the diplomacy screen - don't know what to those will look like yet). I would like to see such things myself as well, but that's not where the focus of the mod will be (initially).

Use the Barbarian Encampment SLIC that Pedrunn has done.
I quite like the idea of a barbarian leader and money if you killed him, furthermore will barb encampments still appear in modern times, i think this would be good if they produced terrorist or something and if the camp image could be upgraded to modern that would be cool too.

I dunno. I like the Encampment feature from Civ3, but from reading the thread it seemed to me that Pedrunn's version works rather differently (correct me if I'm wrong though) - I'm not sure if I like his version. It is on my ToDo list, but I can't promise I'll do it. I *will* probably copy Civ3's Barbarian uprising thingie, that's a good way to help prevent the rich getting richer...

Use the bit of SLC Pedrunn also done to get airfields to look how they are supposed to on mountains

I think I will do this.

As in Civ3 although i cant remember how it worked exactly, but could you make it so that certain terrains have harmful effect upon units as a percetage chance. EG a 5% chance that if you made an army go through desert that they would die of thurst or harsh condisions, if they went through forest 5% chance they would die of disease or an army going through mountain 5% chance they die of harsh condisions etc etc of course some units would have to be ammune to these effects. AND it would be better if it applied if you just leave a unit on a potentially harmful tile for ages. 5% might be to much im not sure, cause you dont exactly want to be loosing whole armies all the time due to disease or hunger BUT it would certainly make the play think more sesibly and realisticly about which routes he took. They AI would also have to know, which might be the halter to this idea. If this idea could be implemented and well balanced i think it would be great

Yes, this is also in the Alexander the Great scenario and I certainly do plan on having terrain (and borders) have a greater effect on unit health, speed, etc.

u dont like the idea of one city building all the wonders and I agree. I think to get around this you should make it so that a popup appears (say 85%) of the time after you have just built a wonder in that city and then try to build another in the same city. This would last for a certain amount of turns. Oh and the message would make it so you couldnt build anymore wonders in that city for whatever amount of turns you decide to make this event last for. It would say something like "General population refuse to set work on {wonder} as they feel it is a waste or misdirection of valuable resources" you could even go further and say it was because they wanted something else to boost food or production (same kinda thing as the city mayor does in its suggestions)

Disabling the building of more than 1 wonder per city seems much easier to me. When you're only allowed to build 3 units per age (or whatever) it should't really matter anyway. But this needs further playtesting, maybe 2 wonders per city (but in different ages) works out better, or maybe even your system. We'll see...

I also believe you should give some unconventional unit the ability to bribe enemy units. Depending on the unit type, if its obsolete and if its a vetern oh and of course the amount of units. The price will be different accoringly. Mybe a diplomat and/or spy unit could do this? Another feature, armies with great leaders in would be unbribable

A nice feature that has been suggested dozens of times before but the problem is that the AI could never deal with it... (We could do some tests to see if creating a special GOAL_BRIBE would help, but I have my doubts).

CTP1 UNITS
I assume as in MM2 there will be units from CtP1 like Hoplites (elite) and Phalanx looking very similar one using the CtP1 graphics and the other the CtP2 graphics. The old War Walker graphics and sounds CtP1 (now that is a cool unit)

See the design doc: yes, I do plan on reusing a bunch of CtP1 graphics, just like Wes did...

If the code for the privateer could be worked out that would be very cool, use the graphics from Civ3 for the unit.

Of course, if the implementation works out okay, I'm very interested in this as well. But first I want to see it in action.

[/quote]Will there be fanatic units for the fundematalism government (or any other governmet types that may apply) and will partisans be able to attack as in Civ2?[/quote]
With the religion concept all religions will probably already have their own unit(s), not sure if there will room for government-specific units as well. But yes, I was actually thinking of giving Partisans an attack value again, at present I find them rather useless myself (but then again, I'm not a big user of Spies and stuff either - the only UWUs I use are Slavers and sometimes Clerics/Televangelists).

Thats I think it for now, im sure there will be more ideas soon but anyway im too tired to bed it is for me
Thanks for reading (if you have)

Thanks for posting. Do post more if you have more ideas. I read everything and will try to implement as much interresting features as possible as well.

[Martin Gühmann]

Originally posted by SMIFFGIG's
Use the bit of SLC Pedrunn also done to get airfields to look how they are supposed to on mountains

And I thought this was only a modification of the tileimp.txt. But anyway this modification of the tileimp.txt is in Cradle, in MedPack2 and in in GoodMod since the first version 0.95 of course. It is missing in ApolytonPack, actual also my modified tileimp.txt from FixMod is missing in the last release version, it uses the original tileimp.txt .

-Martin

[SMIFFGIG]

More Suggestions

Partisan
There is not graphics specified for a partisan unit but i think these ones would be good. For a partisan that could attack (like civ2)

http://apolyton.net/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=56368

Alpine Troops
Would be nice to have Alpine Troops like Civ2 (are they in civ3 i cant remeber) they would be really good movement for snow terrain and really good attack and defence and on other terrain they are pretty crap or tottaly crap as this makes sense (hence the name alpine troops) they could be the ultimate infantry unit on snow terrain.

Future units - Cyborg unit
These could be used as future units, mainly the middle and left ones as the right one to much resembles the war walker from ctp1 which is going to be in HotW anyway.
They could be used as cyborg unit (one in middle) and heavy cyborg(one on left) that are available under the Cybernetasism government i suggested for HotW mod

http://apolyton.net/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=38827

Barbarian Specific units
I think it would be very cool if there where barbarian specific units eg this one http://apolyton.net/forums/showthrea...threadid=56371 as a modern era barbarian

Privateer/Bandit Horserider
Ive just thought, the privateer code by mapfi could be used for the "Bandit Horserider". Im presuming and hoping will have the bandit horserider in it

Capture capitol effects
Right this suggestion I have just thought of but may have been said before. It is, if you take over the enemies capitol they recieve great unhappiness and there civ maybe stay 50% and the other 50% rebel and form a new civ. Now im not sure if I have just thought of this, or picked it up somewhere (did this used to happen in civ1 or something) anyway it would be good

[Locutus]

Thanks for the idea's - I take them into consideration...

[Pedrunn]

Future units - Cyborg unit
These could be used as future units, mainly the middle and left ones as the right one to much resembles the war walker from ctp1 which is going to be in HotW anyway.
They could be used as cyborg unit (one in middle) and heavy cyborg(one on left) that are available under the Cybernetasism government i suggested for HotW mod

wow. Those units look great but have you seen BlueO's one?

[SMIFFGIG]

They are BlueO's?


Arent they?

BTW 2 other ideas. There was a thread on Feat of wonder ideas.


Feat of Wonders
When your population reaches double of the next biggest civ in the game or when you are the first to reach a certain population

When u own a certain amount of cities more than the next most expansive civ or the first to own a specific amount of cities

the first to conquer a certain amount of enemy cities

The first to explore 90% of the map or whatever amount u want

When one of your cities reaches a hundred pop points (im assuming this is still possible in ctp2 as it was in ctp) if not then when your city reaches the highest possible pop points

[Pedrunn]

Yes they are i hadnt see his name in that forum. Now i see how similar they are. He did recicled the ones he did for CTP2 (actually turned them green).
But I meant the BlueO's cyber units for CTP2 in the DB

There is a couple more in his sci-fi mod (specially the dragon).
Locutus, I tried to contact BlueO by PM but he doesnt show up in the forum for quite a while. And he had specified not to be contacted by the apolyton e-mail. Is there any way to you to get his apolyton e-mail with MarkG and send him one or give me so that i can send him one.
I think he should know about the sucess of the Frenzy AI and the version 2 of the city expansion that is already being implemented in the major mods. And also to see if he still have the tiff of his units. To make them correcly since he did not do through alpha channel but palletes what cause his units to have some MBs in size

[SMIFFGIG]

Hey pedrunn, those future units of BlueO's are great, weird how i have never seen them in any mod. Hope they will be in HoTW too


BTW read your PM its important

[Pedrunn]

They were never used because of the size problem i mentioned. No modder wanted to have 1 to 3 MB units opposed to the normally few hundred KB.

Saw your PM and fixed the stuff.

[J Bytheway]

Originally posted by SMIFFGIG
Hey pedrunn, those future units of BlueO's are great, weird how i have never seen them in any mod. Hope they will be in HoTW too

I put them in my Mars mod for CTP - they accounted for more than a third of the file size .

[SMIFFGIG]

they accounted for more than a third of the file size

LOL

I went over to Ctp1 forums before and I found this thread

http://apolyton.net/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=59478

I think a city improvement or even a wonder that gave extra PW would be cool.

Maybe even the effect of a Feat of Wonder could give u extra PW for a certain amount of turns

Wt do u think Locutus, and what u think of the feat of wonders on the previous page ?