OFF-TOPIC

[polarnomad]

So I've had CivIV since last November and today I finally got my first Conquest victory. Settings: Prince, Pangaea, Small. I set it to small because I rarely finish a game on Normal or larger, and Prince because I'm still learning to break out of the building mould I have been trapped in.

Anyway so I built only 4 cities! Then captured half the continent, and razed the remaining cities to the ground! I couldn't believe it when I was looking at the game results: 21 cities razed.! Highest score ever: 30520! I guess I've broken free from my builderer shackles! I'm free! I'm free!

I chose Napoleon since I'd never tried him, and I wish I hadn't. Musketeers are really rather lousy, and their window of usefulness is like a blink of the eye. Also, the Industrial trait was a waste since I hardly built any wonders. Capture them pre-built is really the way to go. "Ooo, very nice Pyramids you have here Bismarck... Did I mention I'll be taking them off your hands?!"

Anyway, thought I'd mention it here since we are building an empire together after all.

Hmmm... Perhaps I'll try Julius next, on Monarch, and go for a first ever Domination victory.

[Kloreep]

UnO will be pleased.

I haven't played it enough to truly grok it, but from what I've been reading and experiencing Civ4 seems to be a very different type of warmongering from what I got used to in Civ3. In Civ3, warmongering was best done early and often, knocking opponents out as early as possible while gaining more territory. New cities might be a little corrupt, but they would give you more maintenance in despotism/monarchy (or even Republic in C3C) and it was overall a good thing. Only once you had expanded beyond the size where a palace+forbidden palace could only just keep corruption in check in all your cities would you want to stop.

Civ4 almost seems to be the reverse. Build up first so that you have the economy to support your military and the high corruption costs in captured cities, then start going on a rampage. Once your economy stretches thin, build up again until you have the resources ready for the next push. (Assuming, of course, that you do keep pushing. )

[polarnomad]

Economically, I wasn't doing too hot at all. Much of the game I had my research percentage set to 40%. I traded techs for as long as I could with the couple civs that would, and then once they all closed their borders, I switched to Mercantilism, which as I discovered, isn't too bad. I was actually behind everybody else in techs for most of the game, which didn't seem to hurt too much since I could focus on what I needed, namely military techs. After the move to Mercantilism and many of my cottages finally growing into monetary powerhouses I managed to get research up to 60% and was able to upgrade units through sheer pillaging.

I've always had this obsession with not letting the finances fall behind, always feeling the need to keep that research percentage as high as possible. It seems that this can be a faulty stance since dropping down to say 70% provides so much room for expansion, with some hit to science, but nothing unacceptable. I found myself quickly prefering more income that I could transfer into military clout, rather than a tech or two just a turn or two sooner.

The other thing that always used to upset me was when a citizen or two became unhappy and refused to work. Well, by the end of the game I had centuries of war weariness, and the lack of Emancipation that sent many of my cities into a slow but steady decline in size. I dealt with it where and how I could. Police state, nationhood, jails, religion, luxuries... but in some cases there was just no helping. However, with a clear path of destruction laid out before me there was no turning back, and all I could do was shrug it off. "Oh go on! Piss and moan then! Victory will be mine nonetheless! Peasants!" I opened up Paris once and I think that almost a third of the population was in revolt, but the war had to continue. My army was built, promoted, upgraded and unstoppable, so if a few citizens starve, then let them! So long as the finances still came in... and if not then a few marauding Knights tearing up the countryside sure brings in needed funds as well.

I felt evil and it felt *cough* good!

Actually, the thing that really opened my eyes to warmongering was the Warlords expansion's Mongol scenario. It was after completing it that I decided to go back to CivIV vanilla to try out some different strategies.

Having a nice, pretty civ will give you the win, but a dirty, limping one can give you the BIG WIN!

[UnOrthOdOx]

Originally posted by Kloreep
Civ4 almost seems to be the reverse. Build up first so that you have the economy to support your military and the high corruption costs in captured cities, then start going on a rampage. Once your economy stretches thin, build up again until you have the resources ready for the next push. (Assuming, of course, that you do keep pushing. )

Blasphemy!!!


Your cities in CIV are much easier to run as city states in the early game compared to CIII. Fact is, Capitols are often THE BEST sites available. My neighbors capitol seems to always make a superb 3rd city site. Rarely, if there is great land around, I'll delay that, sure. Otherwise, may as well grab it and fill in the land between at my leisure. If there is another neighbor in another direction, their capitol can make a great 4th site.

Economically, I wasn't doing too hot at all. Much of the game I had my research percentage set to 40%. I traded techs for as long as I could with the couple civs that would, and then once they all closed their borders, I switched to Mercantilism, which as I discovered, isn't too bad. I was actually behind everybody else in techs for most of the game, which didn't seem to hurt too much since I could focus on what I needed, namely military techs. After the move to Mercantilism and many of my cottages finally growing into monetary powerhouses I managed to get research up to 60% and was able to upgrade units through sheer pillaging.

I've always had this obsession with not letting the finances fall behind, always feeling the need to keep that research percentage as high as possible. It seems that this can be a faulty stance since dropping down to say 70% provides so much room for expansion, with some hit to science, but nothing unacceptable. I found myself quickly prefering more income that I could transfer into military clout, rather than a tech or two just a turn or two sooner.

The other thing that always used to upset me was when a citizen or two became unhappy and refused to work. Well, by the end of the game I had centuries of war weariness, and the lack of Emancipation that sent many of my cities into a slow but steady decline in size. I dealt with it where and how I could. Police state, nationhood, jails, religion, luxuries... but in some cases there was just no helping. However, with a clear path of destruction laid out before me there was no turning back, and all I could do was shrug it off. "Oh go on! Piss and moan then! Victory will be mine nonetheless! Peasants!" I opened up Paris once and I think that almost a third of the population was in revolt, but the war had to continue. My army was built, promoted, upgraded and unstoppable, so if a few citizens starve, then let them! So long as the finances still came in... and if not then a few marauding Knights tearing up the countryside sure brings in needed funds as well.

Happiness: Theaters. I cannot state this enough. THEATERS and SLIDER ADJUSTING. A warmongers best friend.

[polarnomad]

The slider... I didn't even touch the slider!

[polarnomad]

So I moved up to Monarch. Tried Julius, but wasn't thrilled. However, I'm liking the English. Haven't been able to decide who is better though, Lizzy or Victoria. Absolutely loving the Redcoats.

My last game was going pretty well. Wiped two civilizations off "my" continent, but then I decided to move on to the Incans, who I'd been on unfriendly terms with since the beginning of the game. I guess because of the ongoing friction he'd built up an insanely massive military, and although I had some enormous stacks of artillery, infantry and cavalry on his borders, he proceeded to tear me a new one... I've got to say that I've never seen so many units involved in a war. The AI's attacks in between my turns lasted seemingly forever, and I gawked in disbelief as unit after unit showed up out of the FOW.

Anyway... Monarch is proving to be quite challenge.

Started fiddling with the cultural slider and it sure helps, but does it ever eat into finances, and I do wish that I had the option of adjusting the slider for individual cities rather than for the empire as a whole.

[UnOrthOdOx]

I do wish that I had the option of adjusting the slider for individual cities rather than for the empire as a whole.

AMEN!!!!

Define "enormous stacks" and were you at a tech advantage or disadvantage?

[polarnomad]

Well, enormous for me would be about 15 units. I wasn't counting exactly, but when you mouse over occasionally there are so many the list on the side of the screen just has 3 dots at the end...

I'm always at a tech disadvantage, but the military techs were on par.

[UnOrthOdOx]

I hope that's 15 artillery, and not a combined 15 units...

[polarnomad]

Well, I went and opened up one of the saves from that game and I actually have over 30 combined units in one of my cities on the frontline, but clearly not enough artillery.

[UnOrthOdOx]

As a rule of thumb, artillery (whatever tech level) I like to make up around 40-50% of my forces unless there's some specific rush tactic I'm running. (mmmm Impi....)

[polarnomad]

Ok, thanks for the tip.

[UnOrthOdOx]

Just read Mercs 2 is coming out. Figured some of you might be interested.

You are not a soldier. You don't have to play by anyone's rules. You have your own code: you will fulfill the terms of the contract, no matter what. Not everyone in the world of Mercenaries is as honorable. Everyone will try and screw you, given the chance. They think they can get away with it, because they don't know rule #1: EVERYBODY PAYS.

http://www.mercs2.com/

If you haven't played the original, it is pretty fun as well (if showing it's age now), and a lot of the inspiration for me to form the original Team Merc.

[polarnomad]

Thought this article was amusing.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/6292341.stm

[UnOrthOdOx]

Forming a Pirate Team (similar, but fewer restrictions) for the warlords game if any of you are interested.

http://apolyton.net/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=162668