KGB Update and Discussion

[vulture]

I know the values up to about turn 15 or so make sense, because I had worked out (from the starting values) what no. of soldiers each team had up to that point (based on who could build what when and what was researched) and everything fit nicely.

[Ennet]

Is it Sarantiums borders that hasn't yet expanded? (Except for AC and us) Dont have access to civ right now due to that i blew up my cooling system on the only computer capable of running civ4 so cant really check any statistics or see how much cpt you get for founding a religion in a city..

[Ennet]

Guess most of you have a more complete list than i do but im going to post this anyway for those who dont & for easier comparasion..

                   Tech         Value in soldiers
[b] Tier 1[/b]      Fishing                   0
[b] Tier 1[/b]   The Wheel            4000
[b] Tier 1[/b]    Agriculture               0
[b] Tier 1[/b]     Hunting               2000
[b] Tier 1[/b]    Mysticism             1000
[b] Tier 1[/b]      Mining                2000

[b] Tier 2[/b]      Sailing                2000
[b] Tier 2[/b]     Pottery                   0
[b] Tier 2[/b] Animal Husbandry        2000
[b] Tier 2[/b]      Archery               6000
[b] Tier 2[/b]   Meditation                0
[b] Tier 2[/b]   Polytheism               0
[b] Tier 2[/b]     Masonry                 0

[b] Tier 3[/b]    Piresthood           1000
[b] Tier 3[/b]   Monotheism             0
[b] Tier 3[/b]   Bronzeworking      8000

[b] Tier 4[/b]   Ironworking          11000

Oh and a note for the future: you get 1000 soldiers for each city you found, but not the first one..

EDIT: Sorted spaces (hopefully)

[Ennet]

ok.. anyone that can explain how do i space properly?

[Ennet]

Originally posted by notyoueither
5 3840 ACen gain tech (mil)

Starting with mining they popped either hunting or animal husbandry..

Originally posted by notyoueither
7 3760 V1. Vox gain tech, Mysticism (mil) Nana gain tech (non-mil)

Fishing & Pottery possible (As they started with agriculture). Fishing?? Need to calc with landmass & research times to be sure.. though they could always have popped pottery

Originally posted by notyoueither
10 3640 EotS pop 2. ACen or Sara 2 pop. BlOH gain tech (??). ACen or Sara gain tech (??)

AC gained a tech. I assume they researched it. Took them one more turn than us. We increased 6 in score by growing, AC increased in score by 7 (Having already popped a tech earlier)

Originally posted by notyoueither
The ancient techs add to score 6,7,6,7,7,6,6,7,6,7,7,6,7,7,6,7

EDIT: Found some answers earlier in this thread & in nyë's statistics..

[Ennet]

    
T# Year    Shift in soldiers
 1 4000    
 2 3960     
 3 3920   
 4 3880    
 5 3840    +2000  
 6 3800
 7 3760    +2000
 8 3720    +2000
 9 3680
10 3640   +12000
11 3600   +2000
12 3560
13 3520   +8000
14 3480   +1000
15 3440
16 3400
17 3360
18 3320   +2000
19 3280   +2000
20 3240   +6000
21 3200   +2000
22 3160   +4000
23 3120   -2000
24 3080   
25 3040   +6000

EDIT: Please dont pay much attention to this and my previous posts in this thread. It's mostly my own notes atm. Cant access cIV so cant examine any questions i have.. I do have two questions for the team however, how does Territory and population affect score?? Never examined this..

[notyoueither]

Originally posted by Ennet
Is it Sarantiums borders that hasn't yet expanded? (Except for AC and us) Dont have access to civ right now due to that i blew up my cooling system on the only computer capable of running civ4 so cant really check any statistics or see how much cpt you get for founding a religion in a city..

Sara and ACen. They aren't creative.

[notyoueither]

how does Territory and population affect score??

1 pop adds 6 points.

Once territory strated adding, scores jumped by 15-16. The second border expantions added 22-23.

[Ennet]

Sara founded buddism. Just pondered they did get some culture for that.. dont got the hang of all those game mechanics yet..
just cant figure the first border expansion..

[notyoueither]

Originally posted by Ennet
Sara founded buddism. Just pondered they did get some culture for that.. dont got the hang of all those game mechanics yet..
just cant figure the first border expansion..

I was wrong, sort of.

Our score from land just jumped 23 (up to 39) which matches the second jump for Vox (creative).

Curiously, BlOH settled after us and got the first jump after us, but got the second jump before us. They are creative and that led me to think it was due to border expansions.

ACen and Sara got a second jump as well (we all settled on turn 2) but theirs were only 19 and 17 points respectively. None of the three of us are creative.

I should mention, I've never analysed the stats like this. I am flying by the seat of my pants. So input is welcome.

[Ennet]

I'll see if i can get civ4 to run on this machine later tonight my time.. If it runs, i'll examine exactly how it works. Would be fun to figure this out.

[Ennet]

T# Year    Analysis on population
 1 4000  Mercs, Vox & Banana settles 
 2 3960  We, AC & Sara settles           
 3 3920  Horde Settles
 4 3880    
 5 3840    
 6 3800
 7 3760    
 8 3720  Vox grows to size 2 (2,1,1,1,1,1) 
 9 3680
10 3640  We grow to size 2, so does Sara(or AC) (2,2,1,1,1,1)
11 3600  Banana & Horde grows to size 2 (2,2,2,2,1,1) 
12 3560
13 3520   
14 3480   
15 3440
16 3400  We grow to size 3
17 3360  Vox grows to size 3 (3,2,2,2,1,1) 
18 3320   
19 3280  Horde grows to size 3 (3,3,2,2,1,1) 
20 3240   
21 3200   
22 3160  AC(or Sara) grows to size 2 (3,3,2,2,2,1)
23 3120  Merc grows to size 2 (3,3,2,2,2,2) 
24 3080   
25 3040
26 3000  AC grows to size 3 (3,3,3,2,2,2)
27 2960  Vox grew to size 4, sara grew to size 3 (4,3,3,3,2,2)

note: this is not confirmed, need to examine exactly how population affects score and also cross examine with the other graphs.

EDIT: I made these assumption by comparing nye's population statics to difference in score. A coupple of things dont add up. I assumed there was a score increase of 6 per population, which is how i came to these conclutions. AC however get an unexplainable point from somewhere which makes me doubt how the population score system work. Sara and AC growths could be the other way around and Horde growth to size three could be AC..

EDIT II: Thanks to nye, who spent half the night with me going throught this, i think the above information is pretty accurate. I tracked population changes from changes in average population then we both compared that to score changes the same turns, and finaly nye got some top5 cities stats to sort out what was missing

[Ennet]

T# Year 
 1 4000  Mercs, Vox & Nana settles 
 2 3960  
 3 3920  We, AC & Sara settled last turn
 4 3880  Horde Settled last turn  
 5 3840  AC gain tech. (Animal Husbandry/Hunting)
 6 3800
 7 3760  Vox gain tech, Mysticism. Nana gain tech (Fishing/Pottery) +One warrior.
 8 3720  Vox size 2. Sara gain tech, Mysticism.
 9 3680  We discover Mysticism.
10 3640  EotS size 2. Sara(or AC) size 2. AC(or Sara) gain tech(?) Horde gain tech(?) * Vox build their first warrior.
11 3600  Nana & Horde size 2. +Two warriors.
12 3560
13 3520  Merc gain tech, Bronzeworking.  
14 3480  +One warrior.
15 3440  Sara gain tech, Buddism. Sara founds Buddism.
16 3400  EotS size 3.
17 3360  Vox size 3. Vox gain tech, Hinduism. Vox founds Hinduism.
18 3320  Nana gain tech(?)**. Vox adopts Hinduism.
19 3280  Horde size 3. AC gain tech, (?).
20 3240  Merc gain tech (?). Sara gain tech (?)
21 3200  ***
22 3160  AC(or Sara) size 2.
23 3120  Merc size 2
24 3080   
25 3040
26 3000  AC size 3.
27 2960  Vox size 4, Sara size 3.

*Either Archery(6k) or Bronzeworking(8k) with The Wheel(4k), AnimalHusbandry/Mining/Hunting(2k) or two warriors(2k)
note: vox built a warrior this turn. 1k soldiers were from whoever grew to size two. Which leaves 8-10k of soldiers to be explained by techs.
(12k soldiers increase in total)

** Possible: Hunting, Mining, Animal Husbandry & Sailing (not likely). There is a slim possibility two warriors were built and they researched a non-military tech. (In that case they researched fishing->pottery)

***going to fill in the rest from here once we've figured exactly how territory score adds up.

[Ennet]

quick question, do you get soldiers when you grow? that would explain a lot

Originally posted by vulture
We've dropped to 3rd in military in the last 2 turns. The jump of 2000 in 3640 BC is due to city growth and a jump of 12,000 soldiers occurred the turn before. 1000 of that is due to city growth

[vmxa1]

See if this is useful:

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=163098