Spartan academy revisited

[Theseus]

Sorry, Arrian, I didn't mean just the mechanics of which techs... I meant in the context of the other stuff we want to research.

[Arrian]

Ah. Many considerations there, of course. Seeing our starting position is step one (oh, we have cows, let's go hunting -> animal husbandry... in which case tech #3 could be archery).

-Arrian

[DeepO]

I haven't played any CIV MP or PBEM games, but I think that a military tech soon is paramount. For this, I like any tech route through BW (as we'll probably want to rush fast, either chopping or popping)... with archery as a backup. The problem of archery is that it's a dead-end path. AH is of course always nice when we've got cows, but without it loses much of its appeal: writing can be better reached through other paths.

A military unit better than warriors is definately on the agenda, however it might be so that we better build twice as much warriors instead. Up until axes, these perform quite well, all things considered. On defense, of course...

DeepO

[Krill]

Look at it this way. We'll need the warriors for sentry duty anyway...

Archery is decent anyway, no resources required for archers is always good, whereas BW is a gamble...especially if we have trees that are few and far between.

[Arrian]

We really need to know our civ and see our start spot before we can make informed choices.

If we're Mansa, there is added benifit to archery, b/c then we get Skirmishers.

If we have cows/sheep/pigs, AH is a good choice. If we don't... we still want it, but not as early.

If we have wheat/rice/corn, we want agriculture early.

More forest = even more reason to get early BW.

-Arrian

[Krill]

[q=Arrian]If we have cows/pigs/sheep, AH is a good choice. If we don't... we still want it, but not as early.[/q]

Corrected. Sheep and pigs...

[DeepO]

without trees, we might need poprushing...

It's a gamble for sure, just like the others. And let's hope we've got 3 cows in starting range, so this point becomes moot. The reason why I think BW is a bit more important is that it's one of the ways of getting ahead, by rushing stuff, or by axe rushing someone close. You can't archer rush (you can archer-choke), it's difficult to chariot-rush, and IW is too expensive to have a sword-rush... one of the few options we've got is BW.

If we would have chosen the wonder route (by being IND), it's different. There, you need especially early archers for your own defense, the rest doesn't matter at first. We don't seem to go the extreme-wonder route so far, even if we can switch easily if our terrain would be too good to pass on. But until we switch, me might want to consider trying to get something offensive, instead of only defensive...

DeepO

[Krill]

Would anyone here be willing to start a PBEM to test out various strategies?

4 players on a tiny pangaea map, with low water level for example? (low water to make the land similar to what the map generator would throw up on a normla sized map?)

[DeepO]

Originally posted by Krill
Would anyone here be willing to start a PBEM to test out various strategies?

4 players on a tiny pangaea map, with low water level for example? (low water to make the land similar to what the map generator would throw up on a normla sized map?)

We tried something like that at the start of last game, but once Nathan was overrunning me (and Alex soon after), I've got to admit it stopped on my turn

What went wrong there, is that it was a PBEM without much feedback given. I don't know exactly how to do it, but we need team participation in such a thing...

If there are 4 members who want to play a PBEM, by all means do so! If not, it might be better to divide into 2 teams, and have a 4-civ PBEM with 2 emperor AIs present. Play both out in here, so that those not playing can follow both teams, and comment/learn on both sides at once.

DeepO

[Krill]

We could use the same format that AU 601 used. Each person has a DAR thread, in which they post what they are doing, and their thoughts. Everyone apart from the other members playing in the PBEM can have a look in each of the threads, and post, so long as they do not give the game away. I think it would be fair that if a player had a question about the game mechancics, an observer could post a reply to the request though, as GS as a team would have that knowledge...

I would not be able to start playing until next tuesday, as that is when my exams finish, but we would need time to have someone create a balanced map...

[Dominae]

I much prefer Bronze Working to Archery first, even if we are attempting a Skirmisher rush. Not only is Forest-chopping a nice boost to early production, but knowing where the Copper deposits are is essential to an effective choke.

[Arrian]

All the better to start with mining, then

-Arrian

[Theseus]

Originally posted by Dominae
I much prefer Bronze Working to Archery first, even if we are attempting a Skirmisher rush. Not only is Forest-chopping a nice boost to early production, but knowing where the Copper deposits are is essential to an effective choke.

I've been struggling with the earliest research choices... BW makes sense to me, but then how to prioritize military versus religious efforts?

[Dominae]

Well, assuming we get Mansa Musa, we should probably not try for an early Religion unless we have an Oasis or Gold within our capital's radius. It would be a huge waste if we went down that branch early and got nothing out of it except the ability to build Stonehenge/Oracle.

If we do have nice Commerce output, we could try an early Religion, building a bunch of Warriors first instead of a Worker. I know a lot of us want to build those Warriors first anyway, Religion or not, but IMO that's not as good an option as going Worker-first.

[Theseus]

I hope the rest of the team feels that way... I had thought part of the attraction of SPI was to go for one of the earliest religions, but in MP I just can't see doing that at the risk of defense unless the stars are aligned properly.