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Turnplayer Thread #3

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  • OK, a new turn is upon us again, so here we go for T122:

    - We have turned research back on, and Engineering tech is due in 6t of 100% research, pulling in 212 [255] beakers/turn at -52gpt. With the three turns we spent running min science, that means 9 total turns for the tech, which is very respectable for this point in the game. Especially for a civ with no gold/marble/silver and essentially no floodplains tiles.

    - Pink finished a horse archer. The two real choices next are another horse archer or a library, both taking 4t to build. I'm OK with either one, so suggest away. Obviously the former is better for military, the latter for the development of our economy.

    On a related note, do we want the new horse archer to remain at Pink, or head up to Cape Town?

    - Cape Town finished its catapult, and has gone onto elephant as suggested (2t). We can also complete another catapult immediately (1t) if desired, but it seemed the general consensus was for more elephants first.

    - Betty Hur encountered the barb axe in the north, and it will trouble us no more up there!



    Once Betty heals up, she will head off to the Twin Peaks/Cape Town region to serve as axeman defense, and for possible upgrade to horse archer if needed. Persephone (our archer in the region) should be able to fogbust all of the remaining tiles to prevent future barb spread, along with the added visibility from our Blue Barry settler heading up there. Blue Barry arrives and founds his new city on T125, as predicted quite a while back.

    - On a sadder barb note, our scout Sharon moved next to a barb warrior in the fog, and will likely be kicking the bucket next turn.

    - Serious Steve starts connecting the deer at Saxon the Beach next turn. I know sooooo discussed building a road on the grassland tile first, but that road is NOT a "free" build while moving, and I thought it more important to camp the deer first rather than build the road. Could possibly be a weed move, but that was my thought there.

    - Both Saxon the Beach and China Beach have forest chops coming their way next turn.

    - More worker micro stuff:



    In two more turns, the workers at Cape Town (Bernard/Helmholtz) will finish their chop/farm at Cape Town, and that city will be essentially done with worker improvements for a while. I plan to have them both move along the yellow arrows to the south, then split them up, one working on connecting the road down to Pink while the other finally finishes the Airstrip One road (orange) and then moves up north to help out at Blue Barry. With Syme roading in the other direction up from Pink Dot, we should have the Pink/Cape road complete in about 7t, right around when Engineering comes in, granting us enormously more military flexibility. That's the main reason why I think Twin Peaks should be the next city - we'll be able to move military units rapidly enough to defend it!

    Meanwhile, at Airstrip One, Bernard (in red) put a "free" turn into a road, and is moving to chop/cottage another river grassland tile for the capital. I figure this chop will be well put into knocking 60 shields off of Heroic Epic, right? Oh wait, with a forge and Bureaucracy bonuses, plus marble, we'll actually get something like 82 shields out of it - sweet!

    Bob the Builder also put in a "free" turn of roading while moving south. He's heading to chop/mine the forested plains hill tile at Mellow. That forest chop plus growth to size 4 will allow us to double-whip the forge to completion there soon.

    - Unit movement notes: where is Demeter (archer boxed in purple above) heading? Twin Peaks? Pink? I must have missed that in our discussion. Also, where is Lady Godiva (chariot) going? Are we trying to double-move on Constantinople to get vision into the city? I left both units unmoved for now.

    - Imperio has been really quiet with the units lately. Either they've swapped off of military buildup, or they're hiding the new ones somewhere other than Mutal/Lakamha. I'll try to do a more detailed analysis with C&D stuff later.

    - PAL appears to have discovered Optics this turn, *NOT* Paper tech. (mostly_harmless, double-check to make sure I've got this right, will you?) PAL also has nearly run through their bank account - they were running something like -80gpt and are down to 70g left - so they'll have to pause and build cash for a bit before pushing for their next tech. Might be a good idea to chase them with another diplo message and see if they're still interested in working together to share Liberalism benefits (?)

    - I have not whipped Green Acres' worker as yet in case we change our minds, although I think there's a broad consensus that that's the best move. We should be solid on worker labor once we have that one out, especially with China Beach freeing up its two workers for duty elsewhere. More settlers next! (After we finish the Forge at Something Fishy, we definitely whip a settler next. Pink or Airstrip One might also be good candidates once they finish their immediate projects.)

    OK, that should do it for the immediate present. Some comments may change when I have a chance to run the stats in more detail. For example, if it looks like Imperio is genuinely backing off from their aggression, I might push for Library in Pink, which would pay immediate research benefits.
    Attached Files

    Comment


    • Atta girl Betty! You can always rely on Betty. I don't think she can upgrade to a horse archer though. Let's all think positive thoughts for Sharon, our first scout that we rescued from a tribal village all those years ago.

      Suggestion for next city name: Bluebell Wood

      Lady Godiva has finished reconning a possible templars-imperio road. I was mainly looking to see if templars had roaded up to imperio, as that would indicate them working together. But they didn't. I also thought she could see constantinople, but as mh pointed out she can't see that far. She can get back on the road by moving 2NE.

      For Demeter I was moving her ... err ... south a bit. No need to keep every unit in Cape Town. She could be useful to cover the units building the new road.

      Comment


      • Sulla, there was a suggestion to whip Workers and Settlers out of Mellow Yellow and Green Acres. This would mean that we leave forges in the queue while the cities grow, and whip Workers/Settlers instead.

        We can also put in a 5-turn Worker at Something Fishy, because that city is about to start working unimproved tiles, and currently assigned worker isn't even improving a tile city can work right away.

        Comment


        • Originally posted by Sullla View Post
          - Imperio has been really quiet with the units lately. Either they've swapped off of military buildup, or they're hiding the new ones somewhere other than Mutal/Lakamha. I'll try to do a more detailed analysis with C&D stuff later.
          Imperio is hiding new units in the city build queues. They could even be leaving axemen builds unfinished on purpose which will get auto-upgraded to macemen when they get Machinery.


          - PAL appears to have discovered Optics this turn, *NOT* Paper tech.
          We have both prereqs for Optics, right? Just look at the tech screen, it'll show Optics in "Can Trade".

          So it's now or never if we want to think about circumnavigation. Would we consider trading Engineering to PAL for Optics? (I can't see any other trade bait.)

          Comment


          • Yup, PAL defintely has Optics, and Banana has Theo, though I'm not sure what they traded to Templars.

            We definitely want to whip the worker at Green. Seeing as HAs (and chariots Sullla ) upgrade to Knights, then no harm in getting another one out of Pink. It could use a Library now that it has cottages, and I think it'd be best to build it by chop-mining the forest-grass hill, and fiddling the build queue to use these doubled hammers to complete the Library in 1 turn.

            I think Demeter is headed to Pink as MP/hills/city defence. She can also see whether Templars are roading towards us, which would be useful info. Lady G should head back into Imperio-land now that she's checked out the road to nowhere.

            Imperio has done the build queue shuffle a few times already, so we shouldn't get complacent about military.

            Comment


            • If Banana got theology from Templars, and received nothing in return as civstats suggests, then it is clear that they are talking. It seems templars are simply ignoring us. Last night I logged in when I saw that templars had just logged in, yet they logged off as soon as I entered the game. We should send a quick message to Banana to see if they know anything about Templars' plans.

              Comment


              • Chariots don't upgrade to horse archers? Uh, I knew that. I was, err, testing all of you. Based on the comments suggested so far, I'll keep the horse archer build in place at Pink and move Lady Godiva back towards Lakamha, Demeter down south towards Pink.

                Zeviz, you bring up a good point about being able to whip workers/settlers by swapping off forges to them, however I don't really see the need to do so right now. We're doing OK on workers: the whipped one at Green Acres will bring us up to 11 overall. Would more be better? Of course, but we're no longer facing a dire worker shortage.

                Also, Something Fishy is fine. It can work a 2/1 grassland forest tile when it grows, which is not great but not a disaster either. In retrospect, we should have mined its last grassland hill tile earlier instead of clearing the jungle tile to the east of the city. You know what they say about hindsight though.

                We seem to be pretty solid on city management at the moment. I think we should shift focus to diplomacy instead; we need to try and sort out the proposed Banana/Templars research triangle (and find out what the heck Templars are doing!) as well as determine what's going on with PAL. Much better for us to coordinate research paths with our allies than try to wing tech trades on the fly. So get cracking on that, diplomats!

                Comment


                • Can we keep at least one worker near Cape Town in case our resources get pillaged again? The loan of iron from Banana will soon expire.
                  Once the borders are closed and Imperio sits outside Cape Town, the best units we can build are archers and cats! I don't think they will cut it.

                  mh

                  Comment


                  • Well yes, *IF* both Templars AND Imperio declare war on us AND pillage our copper AND our horses, we're in a bad scrape. That does not look likely to happen at present though, and it's kind of like obessing over losing 99% battles. We're not THAT badly off, mh.

                    At least one worker will be working on the Cape/Pink road, and can return to Cape Town quickly if needed. That will have to do, I'm afraid. Having a worker sitting around outside the city doing nothing, just waiting to re-connect a resource if it gets pillages, is a waste we can't afford right now, IMO.

                    Comment


                    • My city build views:

                      Sure we should fit in a library at Pink at some point, probably after the next military unit. I'd like SF to build a barracks after its forge. The settler can come out of green acres instead.

                      Comment


                      • Should we train at least one good defensive unit at Pink (Elephant or Mace) just in case Templars and Imperio attack together? Archers are nice, but we need something more solid.

                        I would also double-move chariot to scout Constantinopole. Templars are doing it to us at Pink anyway. (There is no other reason for their chariot to keep sitting there.)

                        As for workers, our southern cities need more, and we need at least 3 more Settlers. (Red Dot, Burgundy, and Twin Peaks)

                        EDIT: I wonder if PAL is planning to get Astronomy from Liberalims.
                        Last edited by Zeviz; March 19, 2009, 14:04.

                        Comment


                        • Horse archers left to cover Pink are pretty effective units. One mace is fine though if we can spare the build...but it's a lot of hammers that can't cover multiple cities as easily as 2-move units.

                          I'd prefer settlers to workers at this point if we have to choose between no-growth units.

                          Comment


                          • Alright, just to wrap up the last unfinished business from T122:

                            - Double-whipped the worker at Green Acres, as planned previously. Green drops to size 3, will regrow to size 4 in two turns at +8 food surplus. Oh yeah, this is our draft abuse city alright!

                            - There were two tech trades this turn, neither involving our civ:

                            1) Templars traded Theology to Imperio for Construction and Compass
                            2) Templars traded Theology to Banana, did not get something in return

                            Templars' actions appear to conflict with our planned research triangle of Construction/Calendar/Drama, so not sure what's going on there. Looks like Templars may be screwing us over on that one. I think we should send them an email asking them what the heck they are trying to do.

                            - Here is the updated tech comparison:

                            Templars
                            Techs they have we lack: Theology*
                            Techs we have they lack: Civil Service
                            Currently researching: Drama

                            Imperio
                            Techs they have we lack: Feudalism*, Theology
                            Techs we have they lack: Machinery
                            Currently researching: unknown

                            PAL
                            Techs they have we lack: Philosophy*, Optics*
                            Techs we have they lack: none
                            Currently researching: Paper

                            Banana
                            Techs they have we lack: Philosophy, Theology
                            Techs we have they lack: Currency, Construction*
                            Currently researching: Calendar

                            Rabbits
                            Techs they have we lack: none
                            Techs we have they lack: Aesthetics*, Literature*, Mathematics*, Alphabet, Code of Laws, Civil Service, Monotheism*, Monarchy*, Metal Casting, Machinery, Compass, Horseback Riding*, Construction*
                            Currently researching: who cares?

                            That was about it, aside from spending like 90 minutes doing various stat-based things. I did end our turn, although (as usual) that won't matter because hardly any of the other teams did so. I left Lady Godiva unmoved; I might have a chance to double-move her and get info on Constantinople next turn tomorrow morning. If not, we'll just move her back to Lakamaha for spying purposes next turn.

                            Full Stats:

                            General

                            Current Turn:
                            Turn 122 - 175 AD
                            Turn Timer expires at approx (UTC)

                            Active Turn Player:
                            Sullla

                            Tech:
                            Engineering (6t)
                            100% research (249 [13] beakers/turn) @ -51gpt
                            42/1430 beakers overall

                            Gold
                            329g in treasury

                            Cities

                            Airstrip One [size 10] [guarded by Xena and Mariah]:
                            Forge (2t), National Epic (10t)
                            Infrastructure: Palace, Granary, Barracks, Library, Academy, Great Library
                            Great Scientist 128/200, +8 GPP/turn, due in 9t
                            Holding at zero growth until next cottage is finished.

                            Pink Dot [size 7] [guarded by Britney's Spears and Adria and Athena and Allydar]:
                            Horse Archer (4t)
                            Infrastructure: Barracks, Granary, Aqueduct, Hanging Gardens
                            Building some insurance military.

                            China Beach [size 4] [guarded by Ms Piggy]:
                            Horse Archer (3t) [anger duration 4t and 14t]
                            Infrastructure: Granary, Library, Barracks

                            Cape Town [size 5] [guarded by Diana and Fyre Errow and Gillian and Jamie Lynn's Spears and Hannah and Christina and Aphrodite and Demeter and Affirmed and Akara and Nelly and Kitty]:
                            War Elephant (2t)
                            Infrastructure: Barracks, Heroic Epic, Walls

                            Something Fishy [size 4] [guarded by Svava]:
                            Forge (9t) [anger duration 4t and 14t]
                            Infrastructure: Granary, Library, Courthouse

                            Green Acres [size 3] [guarded by Robyn Hood]:
                            Worker (1t) [anger duration 6t and 16t]
                            Infrastructure: Granary, Library, Lighthouse

                            Mellow Yellow [size 3] [guarded by Hera]:
                            Forge (20t), Library (8t) [anger duration 3t]
                            Infrastructure: Granary

                            Saxon the Beach [size 3] [guarded by Betty Hur]:
                            Granary (12t), Moai Statues (61t)
                            Infrastructure: none

                            Non-Combat Units

                            Settler [Blue Barry]:
                            Moving to Blue dot location in north (3t)

                            Scout [Sharon]:
                            Scouting out the eastern continent, preparing to fight for her life!

                            Worker [Winston]:
                            Chopping/Mining grassland hill north of China Beach
                            Chopping (2t)

                            Worker [Bernard]:
                            Build cottages at Airstrip One
                            Moving to tile (2t), getting in "free" road this turn

                            Worker [Mustapha Mond]:
                            Chop/road/plantation silks at Saxon the Beach
                            Chopping (2t)

                            Worker [O'Brien]:
                            Chopping/Farming grassland forest south of Cape Town
                            Farming (2t)

                            Worker [Helmholtz]:
                            Chopping/Farming grassland forest south of Cape Town
                            Farming (2t)

                            Worker [Parsons]:
                            Build cottages at Pink
                            Cottaging (2t)

                            Worker [Syme]:
                            Road between Pink Dot and Cape Town
                            Roading (2t)

                            Worker [John the Savage]:
                            Chop/road Something Fishy's dyes in preparation for Calendar trade
                            Chopping (2t)

                            Worker [Bob the Builder]:
                            Moving south to improve Mellow Yellow
                            Moving to tile (2t), getting in "free" road this turn

                            Worker [Serious Steve]:
                            Improve deer tile at Saxon the Beach
                            Moving to tile (done!)

                            Military Units

                            Galley [RBS Discovery]:
                            Patrolling the Channel

                            War Elephant [Nelly]:
                            Guard Cape Town

                            Maceman [Akara]:
                            Guard Cape Town

                            Horse Archer [Allydar]:
                            Guard Pink Dot

                            Horse Archer [Affirmed]:
                            Guard Cape Town

                            Catapult [Kitty]:
                            Guard Cape Town

                            Axeman [Gillian]:
                            Guarding Cape Town (for now)
                            Heading to Twin Peaks eventually

                            Axeman [Adria]:
                            Guard Pink Dot

                            Spearman [Mariah]:
                            Guard Airstrip One

                            Spearman [Christina]:
                            Guard Cape Town

                            Spearman [Hannah]:
                            Guard Cape Town

                            Spearman [Jamie Lynn's Spears]:
                            Guard Cape Town

                            Spearman [Britney's Spears]:
                            Guard Pink Dot

                            Chariot [Betty Hur]:
                            Healing up after another barb smackdown
                            10XP - our most heroic unit!

                            Chariot [Lady Godiva]:
                            Moving east to get intel on Imperio/Templar cities

                            Archer [Ms Piggy]:
                            Guard China Beach

                            Archer [Diana]:
                            Guard Cape Town

                            Archer [Billy Jean Tell]:
                            Exploring Imperio territory

                            Archer [Robyn Hood]:
                            Guard Green Acres

                            Archer [Svava]:
                            Guard Something Fishy

                            Archer [Fyre Errow]:
                            Guarding Cape Town (for now)
                            Heading to Twin Peaks eventually

                            Archer [Hera]:
                            Guard Mellow Yellow

                            Archer [Athena]:
                            Guard Pink Dot

                            Archer [Aphrodite]:
                            Guard Cape Town

                            Archer [Demeter]:
                            Move to Twin Peaks area

                            Archer [Persepone]:
                            Bust fog in the north to stop barbs from appearing

                            Warrior [Xena]:
                            Guard Airstrip One

                            Warrior [Jennifer]:
                            Exploring the eastern continent

                            Foreign Builds from C&D

                            Templars 160EP
                            Jerusalem = 20 shields (+10)
                            Infrastructure: Palace, Barracks
                            Damascus = N/A, zero shields invested
                            Infrastructure: Terrace, Barracks, Forge
                            Jericho = N/A, zero shields invested
                            Infrastructure: Walls
                            Acre = N/A, zero shields invested
                            Infrastructure: Monument

                            Damascus finished a build in the 60-80 shield range. Not sure what Jericho is up to, as it also finished a build last turn. Templars can't make up their mind on what to build? Acre finished a 30 shield build: we can see that it's a monument. Somewhat useless, as it's also the Jewish Holy City!

                            Also, Damascus has a Forge in it, which I missed earlier because the thing is so darn hard to spot! That was the mystery 120-shield build from about 5 turns earlier.

                            Imperio 212EP
                            Mutal = 40 shields (+20)
                            Infrastructure: Palace, Barracks, Granary, Monument, Stonehenge, Oracle
                            Lakamha = 41 shields (+21)
                            Infrastructure: Barracks, Monument, Islamic shrine
                            Chichen Itza = 42 shields (+4)
                            Infrastructure: Granary, Monument, Lighthouse, Barracks
                            Uxmal = 39 shields (-1)
                            Infrastructure: Monument
                            Mayapan = 7 shields (+7)
                            Infrastructure: Monument, Barracks
                            Calakmul = 50 shields (+7)
                            Infrastructure: Monument

                            Uxmal is doing some build swapping. The other Imperio cities are right in the middle of builds; they could potentially produce quite a large batch of cats/elephants in the next two turns. Anyway, we'll see it if it happens. They would be crazy to come after us right now - they have to see that, right?

                            PAL 58EP
                            The Warning = N/A, zero shields invested
                            Infrastructure: Granary, Barracks, Lighthouse, Library, Forge, Academy
                            Heliopolis = 37 shields (+9)
                            Infrastructure: Granary
                            Alexandria = 12 shields (+12)
                            Infrastructure: Granary, Forge
                            Giza = N/A, zero shields invested
                            Infrastructure: Granary, Lighthouse

                            The Warning finishes something costing right around 120 shields, and we can see a new Forge in the city, so no mystery there! (PAL knows that they are doing, getting a Forge up quickly in their Bureaucracy city.) Not sure what Giza built, it was something fairly cheap so likely a unit. Work boat?

                            Rabbits 48EP
                            Caerbannog = 14 shields (+14)
                            Infrastructure: Palace, Barracks, Library, Great Wall
                            Digger's Burrow = 5 shields (+5)
                            Infrastructure: Barracks, Monument, Granary, Walls
                            Phrygian = 15 shields (+15)
                            Infrastructure: none

                            Rabbits look pretty tapped out from constant whipping at Digger's Burrow. Their other cities still get decent shield production.

                            Population census:
                            PAL 50 (size 11,8,6,6,6,5,4,3,1)
                            RB 41 (10,7,5,5,4,4,3,3)
                            Imp 36 (10,7,6,6,4,3)
                            Ban 28 (9,8,5,4,2)
                            Tem 24 (7,7,6,3,1)
                            Rab 10 (6,3,1)

                            Treasury report:
                            Templars: 104gold (+42gpt)
                            Imperio: 272gold (+3gpt)
                            PAL: 70gold (-86gpt)
                            Rab: 35gold (+-0gpt)
                            Banana: 33 (-3gpt)

                            Comment


                            • Logged in to see that our new HA is still in Pink, and Demeter hasn't moved towards Pink (or back into Cape Town, either)

                              Comment


                              • I wouldn't double-move Lady Godiva since it would be obvious from the direction she is facing. We can tell imperio are moving in and out of our territory from this. Templars however are not doing this at Pink Dot as someone suggested earlier since their chariot always points towards us.

                                Comment

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