Turnplayer Thread #3

[Zeviz]

now that we have temp iron, suggest we remine our copper and leave it with 1 turn to go, so that Imperio cannot repillage it and waste those worker turns.

It would be better if they re-destroy the mine than destroy our only source of horses, so I'd prefer to finish the mine.

[Kylearan]

Hi,

I vote for finishing the copper mine as well. Increased production and maybe protection for our horses, plus forcing Imperio to waste EPs, is more valuable than some worker turns IMHO.

-Kylearan

[Sullla]

Alright, that's a pretty clear consensus on reconnecting copper rather than having it stop 1t away. This whole sabotaging resources is major waste of Imperio's Espionage Points anyway; we can reconnect copper or horses in just 2t with workers in place, and it costs them something like 65 EP for a sabotage mission, not to mention the possibility that their spy could fail and be lost. Plus, if they sabotage copper we build horse units; if they sabotage horses, we build metal units. Do not really understand this team, they've been very clumsy in their handling of this...

Quick question on Green Acres:



Can someone confirm that this is the proper turn to whip the lighthouse? I believe it is; we get instant re-growth to size 3, working clam/clam/wines while building a 6t worker. But others are better with the whipping math than me.

[T-hawk]

If Green Acres does not whip, the fourth citizen will add +1 hammer/turn on the grass forest. If it whips, we add 2 food/turn on the clams. The latter is clearly superior. There is a one-time cost of 1H 4C lost on the wines for a single turn, but that's also balanced with a 2F food savings by growing with a smaller food box.

It's a preference call - not an outright superiority like whipping a granary - but I too think the whip is a clear call.

[Sullla]

Alright! I have finished up the last remaining details for T115. The last couple things were:

- Offered Literature to Imperio, as part of our deal.
- Whipped the lighthouse in Green Acres (see above).
- Whipped the granary in Mellow Yellow.

I ended our turn, since we have nothing further to do. Let's see if we manage to finish before the timer runs all the way to zero. (We actually finished early last turn, for the first time in ages!)

[mostly-harmless]

Looking at the map, here is a bold suggestion for a move:

Move Lady Godiva onto the galley in the channel and ship her over to PALs northern border to capture the barb city together with our wandering warrior.

Lady Godiva could attack in mere 7 turns (T122).
We only noticed the barb city on T115. If that was the turn it spawned it will not grow to size 2 until T123.
However, if we decide not to keep it anyway and just do it for cash, we could go ahead with the T122 attack date.
If the barb city is already guarded by archers, there is probably no sense in doing it.
Luckily we have the warrior in position to check out whether the horse are still pillageable (T116) (which I doubt from the mouse-over info) AND have a look at the barb city defenders in two turns from now (T117).

The movement of the Lady Godiva and the Galley are the same for those next two turns, whether we go for it or not. (ie Lady Godiva moves north, Galley moves south)

Lets have some comments on this and I can draw up a detailed movement plan.

mh

[Sullla]

Go ahead and draw up the movement plans, mh. Color me intrigued by your suggestion.

[sooooo]

OK, so let's make some plans about what to do with Saxon the Beach. It is currently defended by Betty, but we know there is at least one axeman in the fog. Also it needs worker actions.

We can whip China Beach next turn (as it produces our new GS ). This gives us a worker close to the city. I think archer after that, to go and defend it and allow Betty Hur to patrol the fog and kill that axeman.

It's a little late right now, but I propose changing Saxon from Maoi to lighthouse. The reason being that Maoi gets us 1/1/2 tiles which are not really worth working. If we get lighthouse first, that gives us a 3/0/2 lake tile which is very good for growth. I haven't done the math, but I would guess that working deer, 3/0/2 lake tile and all the while mining the two grasslands seems good. We have four tiles anyway (when improved!) that are better than 2/1/2 Maoi coast, so the urge for the wonder is not so important. So my suggestion is: switch to lighthouse, use our worker we get to improve deer. Whip lighthouse (form the extra HG pop) and then go on to Maoi. Use worker to build two grassland hills and as we regrow from the whip we will grow into a high-production city that can build the statues pretty quickly. At size 5 and greater it can then use the Maoi coast.

[sooooo]

OK, a change of plan for my Saxon build order:

Change to granary, whip it with the HG citizen. Then lighthouse, whip it. Then Maoi.

[Dreylin]

Once we whip China Beach, it won't need to MP archer for a few turns; could we send her up towards Saxon now/next turn and then replace her in a few turns?

[sooooo]

That's a good idea Dreylin. Any other opinions out there about changing Saxon to granary -> lighthouse -> Maoi?

[mostly-harmless]

Well, fine by me. I don't have a strong opinion about Saxon apart from freeing that Chariot to hunt down the barb axe and then onward to front line duty.

mh

[Sullla]

Well it's too late for a full turn report, but we have started T116, and I can pass on some quick news... almost all of it very good!

- We got the "soldiers returning home from war" event AGAIN! This is like a mini-Hanging Gardens, +10 food in every city. 80 free food total spread across our 8 cities. And what's even better - the timing COULD NOT be more perfect, letting us take advantage of all that free food next turn (T117), then complete the Gardens on T118 and jump ANOTHER pop point in all our cities. Airstrip One is gonna be size 10 in just 3-4 turns.

- We also popped our long-awaited Great Scientist in China Beach! I moved him 3 tiles east towards the capital. Last chance to call for something other than Academy (which is my very, very strong preference).

- Horseback Riding discovered, we can start research on Construction now. I will run the exact numbers tomorrow, it looks like going 0% research, followed by two turns of 100% science will get us the most beakers, especially since we will add an Academy next turn in the capital, at the same time we increase research to max! Also, someone shoot off a quick email to PAL telling them we will send them HBR this turn, as promised.

- Imperio built a horse archer in Mutal. Whether this dictates our build choice at Cape Town is up for the team to decide.

Anyway, much more coming tomorrow, just wanted to pass on the good news. We have a LOT of micro stuff to do, after suddenly getting a mass influx of food out of nowhere dumped into our laps.

[regoarrarr]

Okay - I did a bit of micro analysis tonight. It seems that our best timing would be to get every city we can to grow on T118. I tested that doing so allows you to grow (to the smaller food box) and then get jumped another pop point with the HG.

i.e. Airstrip One is currently at size 8, 30/36 in the box and +3 pt. So on T117 it goes to 33/36, then on the interturn it grows to 36/36, goes to size 9, and then is HG'd to size 10.

So here are our cities as they currently stand:

A1 - 30/36, +3
PD - 21/30, +4
CB - 28/32 - currently building a worker (and still has the 2 scis)
Cape - 22/28, +0
SFish - 32/30, +3
GreenAc - 28/26, worker
Mello - 22/22 +4
Saxon - 14/22 +2

So,
* A1 is good - we'll hit that with no changes
* PD needs just 1 over the next 2 turns, which, if I was calculating correctly, it could do without altering the HG time by working a grass forest instead of one hill next turn
* Green Acres should swap off the worker at least for one turn to allow it to grow to size 4
* Mello will grow to size 2 next turn and I would swap it over to lighthouse (And possibly whip on T118)
* Saxon can't do anything that I can see that would get it to grow in the next 2 turns (short of ANOTHER soldiers returning home event ). I would swap to granary here then lighthouse then Moai as I think has been suggested upthread.

So 3 interesting cases
* Cape Town. We could get it to grow at the cost of 4 pt, or 8 total (16 total with the Epic). If we did that, it would grow to size 6 (15/32 if it has a granary which I think it does) on T118, as opposed to size 5 22/30 if we stay as is. I see that it doesn't have that many improved tiles to work but I'm sure we could figure out something :whip:
* China Beach. We could double whip the worker this turn, which would put it at size 4, to grow to size 5 on T117 and then HG'd to size 6 on T118. If we waited one turn, we'd get some more hammer overflow while still growing to size 6, though we'd also lose 2 food by delaying the camp on the deer by one turn.
* SOmething Fishy - I tried but I don't think (Even with a granary) that we could get it to grow and then grow again in 2 turns. We get close, but can't do it - but maybe someone better at micro'ing can get it done

[T-hawk]

If a city begins a turn with a food box beyond maximum, it will grow, even if it's building a worker or settler.

Green Acres doesn't have to change anything, it'll grow even while building the worker.

China Beach should double whip the worker this turn - that will put it at 28/28 and it can grow this turn even while finishing the worker.

Cape Town definitely should be pushed to grow. 4 base hammers exchanged for 6 food translates into an extra city size which exchanges back for 30 base hammers of whip.