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  • The Essential Civ 3 - Guidelines

    WELCOME! REVISED GUIDELINES! READ ME FIRST!

    The Essential Civ 3

    Last year Apolyton members produced The List, a 500 page document sent to Firaxis that included innumerable suggestions for Civ 3. By following a credo of "If Only One Idea..." that list was successful in getting at least some of its ideas into the game prototype at Firaxis, and perhaps more.

    The problem, if there was one, is that 500 pages of ideas can't possibly be included in the game. Also, it doesn't give anybody a clear idea of what MOST fans think Civ 3 should look like. The Essential Civ 3 list will. The EC3 will reveal to Firaxis and fans alike what the majority of players believe are the ten most essential changes for Civ 3.

    The EC3 is not intended to be just a list of ideas. It is a list intended to give a unified vision. Where The List told everything players want, the EC3 will clarify what players value. Something the designers can refer to as a guide when weighing the thousands of suggestions. And something to give the fans the confidence of knowing that, if nothing else, at least we showed 'em what we wanted.

    The EC3 demands that each fan who participates ask themself the hard question, "What is the ONE THING I want to see in Civ 3?" By doing that, where the List was 500 pages, the EC3 will be ONE PAGE (well, about). So welcome, and whether this is your first time here or whether you're a seasoned veteran, we want your ideas!

    1. Nominating and Discussing

    Until the end of the day, March 1, you will find two submission threads in this forum:

    Essential Civ 3 Fixes
    Essential Civ 3 New Ideas

    As long as they're open, you may nominate ONE IDEA in each thread. Each idea nominated in these two threads will be given an ID number and cut and pasted by Korn469 or Raingoon into its own thread for discussion. THIS IS THE TIME TO DISCUSS EVERYONE'S IDEAS! This phase will last until 11:59 EST, Wednesday March 1, 2000.

    2. Seconding the Nominations

    After the March 1st deadline to submit Fixes or New Ideas all authors have until 11:59 EST, Friday March 3rd to discuss, revise, and reconsider the final draft of their idea. This is the draft you want submitted for nomination to the final list. And, if ultimately included on the final list, this is the draft that will be sent to Firaxis.

    Starting on Saturday March 4th we will post the final nominating threads, using the final draft of each idea. You may second up to four other nominations (you are assumed to have seconded your own). The authors should be sure their ideas have been edited to their liking. Once this phase begins, you will not be able to change the language of your idea again.

    To second a nomination, simply post to that particular thread "I second this." After one week the top 5 nominated ideas in each category will be compiled together in a list of 10 ideas.

    3. The Final Vote

    After the initial nominating and discussion and after the final nominating and "seconding" process, Mark or Dan will put up the list of 10 ideas on a poll in the Civ 3 main page for another week, and everyone will vote for or against the entire Essential Civ 3 List. If the list does not get a 60% majority it will not be considered "essential" and will NOT get sent to Firaxis. If it does receive a 60% endorsement, then off it goes!

    It is important to remember that there will be a lot of great ideas that don't make the Essential Civ 3 list -- possibly even your own. And that's ok because the design team at Firaxis has probably already seen all our ideas many times before. We aren't really trying to send them one more list. They've already got some pretty good ones. Hopefully, we are sending them a picture of what we, the fans, want to see changed the MOST -- what will make it a true Civ 3 and not a "Civ 2.5." So, in the final vote, even if your idea is not in the top 5 of either category, ask yourself if the spirit of your idea is.

    Right now we're in the heat of the discussion phase. No matter what your idea, we want to hear it! And we want to hear what you think of the ideas already posted. To post and read what's currently being discussed, here again are the two main threads:

    Essential Civ 3 Fixes
    Essential Civ 3 New Ideas

    Remember, the Essential Civ3 List will stop taking submissions at 11:59 EST Wednesday March 1st 2000. Happy posting!


    <font size=1 face=Arial color=444444>[This message has been edited by raingoon (edited February 24, 2000).]</font>

  • #2
    REMINDER: PLEASE glance at the new ideas and fixes listed to see if yours has already been nominated.
    <font size=1 face=Arial color=444444>[This message has been edited by raingoon (edited February 17, 2000).]</font>

    Comment


    • #3
      I'd like to have 3 maps on one: The political map (as in CIV1/2), the Religion map (Only possyble after Monotheism), The Market Dominance map (After the Corporation)
      You could win: as in CIV1/2 by military conquest/AC, but also by converting all the map to your religion, or by market dominance of all the map.
      In this way, a small, no army, country could be a major power in the game (Vatican, Swiss, ...)
      ------
      OOps, wrong place. Sorry. Copy posted at correct place.
      ------
      <font size=1 face=Arial color=444444>[This message has been edited by carnide_ (edited February 18, 2000).]</font>

      Comment


      • #4
        -=*bump*=-
        I've been on these boards for a long time and I still don't know what to think when it comes to you -- FrantzX, December 21, 2001

        "Yin": Your friendly, neighborhood negative cosmic force.

        Comment


        • #5
          Raingoon, korn469:
          Two questions.
          1. There is a fix (No.1) called "trade" and a new idea (No.25) called "improved trade". Is that OK? (They look pretty much the same for me)
          2. There 2 two new ideas about graphics, "improved graphics" and "fast graphics". Shouldn't they be fixes instead of new ideas ?
          "The only way to avoid being miserable is not to have enough leisure to wonder whether you are happy or not. "
          --George Bernard Shaw
          A fast word about oral contraception. I asked a girl to go to bed with me and she said "no".
          --Woody Allen

          Comment


          • #6
            Tiberius

            i'll look into it and figure out what to do about all the problems you have addressed sometime tommorrow

            korn469

            Comment


            • #7
              Korn469, Tiberius:

              There is a motion to combine the graphics idea, but only one of the authors has so far consented. ICS and borders also have redundant suggestions and could be combined. I suggest we wait to make those calls when we're about to begin officially "seconding" the nominations. Then we can combine all likeminded suggestions and give the authors a last chance to say why they shouldn't be combined, if they're so inclined, which I'm sure won't be the case.

              Regarding the fix/new idea trade confusion -- I suggest that we give people wide latitude to post where they believe their idea is most appropriate. Before the second phase starts and after everyone's had their say, again, we can make the appropriate adjustments.

              Comment


              • #8
                Sounds good to me.
                Though I think after the first phase we should try to combine the similar proposals, except the very specific ones, because otherwise we can lost a lot of good ideas.
                For example, if there will be 3 different proposals for trade, and all 3 will receive a number of votes but not enough to be in the top 10, that will be a loss, because (almost) everybody want a better trade system. Or it could happen exactly the contrary: there could be 3 different ideas about trade in the top 10, telling almost the same thing, and because of them missing great ideas like energy, stacked combat, and so on.
                Please do not misunderstand my suggestions, I like trade more than war, but the list must be the best we can do.
                "The only way to avoid being miserable is not to have enough leisure to wonder whether you are happy or not. "
                --George Bernard Shaw
                A fast word about oral contraception. I asked a girl to go to bed with me and she said "no".
                --Woody Allen

                Comment


                • #9
                  Your concerns are well-founded. I'm sure everything will straighten themselves out -- nobody wants a list with three variations of one idea.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    bump

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      maybe we could come up with a conference committee or something so that three variations of one idea would neither not make the list because of splitting the votes between them, or having three of them making the list at the expense of other ideas

                      korn469

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        We could just look at what ideas are essentially the same and poll those authors to see if they mind combining them. What would a "conference committee" be/do?

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          raingoon, how about keeping a list of links to the threads of the proposals on the first post of each main thread(Fixes and Ideas)?

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            markG

                            good idea! since raingoon started both threads i guess he will have to edit his threads, but that is a good idea...

                            raingoon

                            a conference committee is having the idea posters if at all possible tying the similar ideas together in one thread

                            New Business

                            here are two new ideas i just had...

                            1. or the final list, everyone needs to redraft their final idea, and make it as complete as possible. but the entire length of the idea should be 100 words or less...so basically

                            when the time comes we want people to write the final idea that people get to nominate for the candidate list. these ideas should be clear consise, lacking spelling or major gramatical errors, and should be 100 words or less.

                            2. after the march 1st deadline to submit Fixes or New Ideas we should give the people to Friday March 3rd to discuss, revise, and reconsider their final idea draft. Then starting on Saturday March 4th we should post the nominating threads using the final draft of each idea...which all participants must do in order to have their idea posted, after March 1st and before March 3rd the person who submitted the idea must post a final draft to have it posted for the nominating threads...then we move onto the nominating process

                            so basically we give the people a few days to get a final draft done and for allow time for any last minute improvement of the ideas

                            how does that sound?

                            korn469

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Korn469, sounds fine.

                              We will have to make an effort to keep this forum from becoming unmanageable -- and to that end I'll try to get those links up, just as soon as Mark or someone explains how to do that (I never had to do that before)!

                              Also, those who have already begun seconding ideas -- will they be asked to start again on March 4? OR do we transfer their seconds automatically to the new nominating threads?

                              Comment

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