The key to AI greatness

[lockstep]

Thanks for the clarification, Soren. Mod-makers will be glad to know for sure that the AI can actually cope with additional buildings.

BTW, korn also added a 'mill', a medieval improvement (available with engineering) that increased shield-production by 25%. Result: The AI's LOVED to build mills (the mod was based on v1.17).

[Solver]

Thanks Soren. I'm really thinking to change priorities now... yes, I want the AI to build more factories.

While personalities clearly add up to the fun, sometimes I prefer challenge, for challenge is fun.

[alexman]

Originally posted by Soren Johnson Firaxis


btw, these difference were meant to give the AI's personality... adding to the fun, not the difficulty of the game. If you want to build a killer AI, messing with these figures is probably the best place to start.

Thank you!! Making a killer AI was the point of this thread before DeepO started bashing the idea!

[lockstep]

Good news indeed for the deity players who are obsessed with creating killer AI's.

[Arrian]

Wow, so in the standard bic, only 3 out of 16 civs will build marketplaces & banks "often."

I think the real key is the combo of trade & wealth, to make sure they build those marketplaces. The marketplace is one of the single best improvements in the game.

Questions:

- do courthouses fall under "production" ?
- do markets also fall under "happiness" ?
- does "expl" mean scouts and explorers? If so, that should be a "never build" for all civs. Or does this mean civs will build regular units which are told to explore?

I think all civs need to "build often" Wealth, Trade and Production. Militaristic civs could then also build often offensive units, whereas the "builder" civs could build often scientific improvements instead (Germany could do both... ignoring "culture" since their culture will come from the science improvements anyways).

I think this would help the AI a lot. Good for mods/scenarios.

-Arrian

[DeepO]

Originally posted by alexman
Thank you!! Making a killer AI was the point of this thread before DeepO started bashing the idea!

You do know that I was only trying to give constructive criticism, and had no bashing in mind, don't you?

And even if Soren might correct me again, I still feel that in scenarios, the biggest killer AIs would be those that have good starting positions, good tastes as to what to build, and 'weak' AI neighbours... these would be more killer than those in the same position but with strong AI neighbours as they more or less balance each other out. In that respect, the biggest killer AIs will come from the original .bic, although you have more chance of getting (lesser) killer AIs with your changes.

No, I won't give in that easily

DeepO

[alexman]

Originally posted by Arrian
- do courthouses fall under "production" ?

My guess is no. The game probably considers "production" improvements the ones that have a non-zero value in the production box in the editor.

- do markets also fall under "happiness" ?

Again, I think no. Just like for production, there is a "happy face" box in the editor. Marketplaces have zero there.

- does "expl" mean scouts and explorers? If so, that should be a "never build" for all civs.

Not sure if it's only for those units, but if it is, I think it should be set to "often" for expansionist civs so they can take advantage of their scouts. More scouts = more goody huts = more power! Explorers are another story, but I have never seen the AI build one - not even the Iroquois that have this flag checked.

Originally posted by DeepO
You do know that I was only trying to give constructive criticism, and had no bashing in mind, don't you?

Of course I do! That's why I added the smiley. I appreciate your feedback!

[DeepO]

Oh, BTW, when you want the AIs to build marketplaces, how about modding them so they give, on top of the usual advantages, 1 shield, 1 culture, 1 beaker? This would mean they are absolutely the highest ranking improvement an AI can build, without over doing their effects... and this regardless of the above table

DeepO

[lockstep]

Originally posted by alexman
I think no. Just like for production, there is a "happy face" box in the editor. Marketplaces have zero there.

OTOH, marketplaces have the 'increases luxury trade' flag.

[lockstep]

Originally posted by DeepO
Oh, BTW, when you want the AIs to build marketplaces, how about modding them so they give, on top of the usual advantages, 1 shield, 1 culture, 1 beaker?

Only no. 2 (1 culture) is currently possible with the editor.

[Soren Johnson]

Originally posted by alexman

My guess is no. The game probably considers "production" improvements the ones that have a non-zero value in the production box in the editor.


Again, I think no. Just like for production, there is a "happy face" box in the editor. Marketplaces have zero there.

actually, the answer is yes in both cases...

[DeepO]

And 5% production, 5% science extra? it would more or less be the same...

DeepO

[lockstep]

Hmm ... okay, courthouses and police stations reduce waste, therefore increase production.

Another guess: harbors would be 'growth' as well as 'trade' improvements.

EDIT: If I split harbors into docks (which would yield +1 food per water tile) and harbors (which would provide trade links and veteran sea units), will the AI cope with these changes?

[alexman]

Originally posted by Soren Johnson Firaxis


actually, the answer is yes in both cases...

Wow! That would mean marketplaces belong to three groups (trade, wealth, and happiness). Why don't they get built more often? A mystery to me...

Thanks for the answer, btw. I don't suppose it would be possible to get a complete list of what falls in each category, would it? It kind of defeats the purpose of having these things editable if we don't know what they do!

[dunk]

Originally posted by alexman

Thanks for the answer, btw. I don't suppose it would be possible to get a complete list of what falls in each category, would it?

This would be great for modders. Not only the where the current buildings lie, but why the buildings are in those categories. This way, we'll have an idea as to what happens when we create new buildings / wonders. Ideally, we should have a manual for the editor with this kind of information. I mean, look at all the conjecture we've had in this thread as to what these flags do. Even if it's just a big test file available through download only.

Firaxis, please, a user's guide or manual for the editor?