Why, oh why does the poor AI...

[Pyrodrew]

Why does the AI build a Coal Plant when a Hydro Plant can be built instead? And then why does it build a Hydro Plant as soon as it’s done with the Coal Plant?!

The only differences between the Coal Plant & Hydro Plant are pollution & shield cost. Therefore, with production equal, I would wager the AI priorities 1st on shield cost...
Coal Plant 160shields
Hydro Plant 240shields
And then evaluates the 2 plants on pollution (and probably production). If the potential plant has lower pollution then it gets built...
Coal Plant 2pollution
Hydro Plant 0 pollution

I would have thought pollution would be considered 1st, but then if someone made a 'Super Plant' costing 2400shields & -2 pollution the AI would build that 1st instead... but why worry about that if it throws off the original game? From Beta Testing they probably found Coal Plants available when Hydro Plants were not & therefore never saw this problem.

The AI probably does not build Nuclear Plants due their explosion risk... the AI has enough things to worry about.

Why does the AI build regular units in newly founded cities of a large empire when veteran defenders can easily be brought from elsewhere?

From what I've seen, getting the settler out asap takes top priority. The settler may settle on the other side of the world or end up being killed before reaching its destination, so the empire does not care about the settler's location or safety (except to provide an escort). Once the new city is founded the city may be on the other side of the world where it would take too long for the empire to send defenders. Other defense units probably have their own preset missions (guard London, escort next Settler, etc.) that they are not willing to change & other cities have their own goals (build bank, build next Settler, etc.) that could care less about that new city which might be built in ice & tundra.

Why doesn't the AI switch production in its cities unless it's for a Wonder that has already been built? It should check and possibly reassign production when it learns a new technology, if not every turn. Extra bonus: could the AI be made to use pre-builds like us humans?

That would certainly make the AI more competitive, including for building wonders.

[Arrian]

Originally posted by alexman
BUT, there is a small problem with the illusion that Civ3 SI presents to us right now. The AI bonuses give the human a good (often too good) challenge early-on in the game, but are not hardly enough in the late game. Our goal here is to make the AI behave more like the human at the city-level so that it can use its bonuses more effectively in the latter part of the game.

That's it, in a nutshell. Well said, Alexman. Though I think Zachriel's point is important to remember, I do think that the AI can be poked and prodded into making smarter choices that will help make it more competitive, particularly in the mid-to-late game, and perhaps even lessen the need for the huge bonuses it gets on the upper levels.

-Arrian

[Nor Me]

Culture appears to be one of the most important factors here.
If you had computers, the research lab would come immeadiately after the cathedral.

I gave factories 3 culture and it built one 1st-3rd.

[alexman]

Originally posted by Nor Me
I gave factories 3 culture and it built one 1st-3rd.

That's good to know. Definitely a reason not to flag culture as a build-often, but somehow I have a realism problem with giving factories a cultural value, not to mention it unbalancing the cultural victory condition. A better solution IMO would be to increase the maintenance of factories so that humans build them later as well.

[alexman]

I just noticed something interesting in PtW. Spain has Wealth flagged as build-never. That means it never builds banks and wealth . (It does build marketplaces because of trade marked as build-often).

I can't believe this is intentional. Either this is a silly bug, or have I messed up my own civ3X.bix file. Can anyone comfirm that Spain has Wealth flagged as build-never?

[jshelr]

"If the AU Mod can pass the equivalent of a Turing Test with the bunch of us, that's good enough for me."

LoL

[Random Passerby]

An interesting human handicap I play with more often than not: no factories EVER. Makes the game a lot more even, but the sad part is, on Monarch I can still match (sometimes beat!) comparably sized empires for total production (although they smack me silly on wonder/spaceship races if I don't use prebuilds and/or get to the key techs first). Even if I'm not cramming cities together very closely, for that matter.

[Catt]

Alexman - great thread and work You and Theseus come out with 2 great threads while the rest of us are trying to get our arms around PTW.

Originally posted by alexman
I just noticed something interesting in PtW. Spain has Wealth flagged as build-never. That means it never builds banks and wealth . (It does build marketplaces because of trade marked as build-often).

I can't believe this is intentional. Either this is a silly bug, or have I messed up my own civ3X.bix file. Can anyone comfirm that Spain has Wealth flagged as build-never?

Believe it or not, in the default .bix, Spain has wealth checked as build-never. (Does this really mean no banks, ever? and therefore no stock markets, no wall street )

Catt

[Killerdaffy]

Originally posted by alexman
A better solution IMO would be to increase the maintenance of factories so that humans build them later as well.

Unless you yank up the maintenance to 10 gold or higher it is not going to make a difference for any city with a decent production. There has to be another solution.

And regarding those bank-less Spanish: That, apart from hurting the AI, clashes head-on with reality: The country is one over the most overbanked in the world.

[alexman]

Originally posted by Killerdaffy

Unless you yank up the maintenance to 10 gold or higher it is not going to make a difference for any city with a decent production.

Actually, assuming one shield and one commerce are of equal value, a 4 or 5 gold maintenance of factories would make them a bad deal for cities with under 8 or 10 blue (uncorrupted) shields. Right now the crossover is 6 blue shields.

Also, keep in mind that in order for a building to become a priority, it not only has to be worth building, it has to be a better deal than other buildings. For example, a marketplace is worth building if the city has an income of 2 uncorrupted gold.

[Catt]

Re: Spanish Never Build Wealth

Well, I have spent what very little free time I have had recently playing PTW, and haven't really spent any constructive time to explore the editor or take a look at new civ development habits. But the idea that the Spanish have a "never build wealth" flag checked that precludes banks (and stock exchanges and wall street) startled me until I realized that I had a saved game with a well-developed competitive Spain and that I could investigate Madrid and have a peek for myself.

See the shot below. Spain is approximately mid / mid-late industrial age. They are a very good-sized empire, well-developed, etc. currently at war (hence the communism). Madrid itself has built either 2 or 3 wonders (including Shakespeare's, which explains the lack of entertainers in a 27-pop city). What Madrid has not built is a bank. Nor a stock exchange. Note that with 70% of its income going to the treasury, a size 27 city is contributing a whopping 37 gold in taxes. That's a shame.

Also, on a different topic, why, oh why is Madrid producing a 90-shield guerilla (6.6.1) instead of a 90-shield infantry (6.10.1) with an abundance of rubber available?

Catt

[alexman]

Thanks for that screenshot Catt!!

As for the guerrila, that's amazing! Both units have identical stats (including offense and defense flags for the AI) except for attack strength. My guess is that the AI is building a unit for defense, so it doesn't look at the attack strength.

[Catt]

Originally posted by alexman
As for the guerrila, that's amazing! Both units have identical stats (including offense and defense flags for the AI) except for attack strength. My guess is that the AI is building a unit for defense, so it doesn't look at the attack strength.

I think you got your attack and defense backwards -- both units have a 6 attack, 1 movement, and cost 90 shields. But the infantry has a 10 defense versus a 6 defense of the guerilla. If both units have offense and defense flags checked, one would expect that infantry would always be selected over guerilla (equal attack & movement, higher defense), with the only exception being when a civ does not have access to rubber.

Bizarre.

Catt

[alexman]

Originally posted by Catt


I think you got your attack and defense backwards

of course...

Until it's fixed by Soren in the next patch , this is another reason to keep the 8-10-1 infantry boost in the PTW version of the AU mod. The guerilla would become 7-6-1 or something.

[player1]

Originally posted by Catt
Believe it or not, in the default .bix, Spain has wealth checked as build-never. (Does this really mean no banks, ever? and therefore no stock markets, no wall street )

Catt

I mailed to Speed Bump about this:

>>>>>>>>>>
Barry,

While I was MODing, I've seen that Spain civ has Build Never strategy
selected for Wealth.

Do you know is this intentional or BUG?


Thanks,
Andrej Damjanovic (aka player1)
Free MOD developer
>>>>>>>>>>

And here is the reply:

>>>>>>>>>>
That is intentional. I'm not sure why, but I know it is listed that way in
the design document.

Barry Caudill
QA Manager
Firaxis Games
>>>>>>>>>>