Recycling Blitz

[dawidge]

If you want to keep the city, but aren't concerned about the existing structures, you can use this to pump out the indigenous population (which will start starving, anyway, in most circumstances).

[Fitz]

Originally posted by Aeson
I've never had a city flip on the first turn. It may not be 100% reliable, but if it isn't, it's very very close to it.

Pretty sure I have lots of times, since 1.21f too. So I would say it is considerably less than 100%.

Do you typically have a very large total civ culture compared to your enemies? IF so, you would rarely see flips period, so the odds of it happenening on the first turn would be low too. In addition, if you typically keep lots of troops in a newly captured city (to heal for example) and then move them out later (ie when they are healed) then you'll aslo see more chance of a flip.

Lets do a quick rough flip chance estimate (very rough, just for an idea). Both assume you leave 5 troops inside to heal, and the first assumes you have double the enemy culture, the second triple. Four times closer to the enemy capitol, 30 citizens, 9 squares in enemy territory (ie 3 sides of the fat Xs outer portions) Citizens in resistance (I'll guess 15 until you geive me a realistic number). More enemy culture that yours. No WLTKD or Disorder.

Chance of flip #1: ((15+15*2+9)*2*1*1/2 - 5)/500 = 10.8%

Chance of flip #2: ((15+15*2+9)*2*1*1/3 - 5)/500 = 6.2%

If those numbers look reasonable, maybe yer right, maybe yer rong about a first turn flip. IIRC you are a pretty heavy conquer, so I can assume that you would be in this situation more than 10 times per late game, and certainly you would probably have noticed that first turn flip after ten games.

[heidlejohn]

Can a city flip while it is still in resistance? The first turn the city is almost always in resistance and may be in resistance for a few more turns after that. I don't have any specific information but maybe cities will NOT flip while they are in resistance.

Anyone know?

[Purple]

Re: Recycling Blitz

Originally posted by Aeson
Move the Settler to the tile towards enemy territory while the captured city is still there, then disband the captured city (sell off the rest of the improvements first) and build your new city in enemy territory, pushing their borders further back.

The only flaw in this scheme (a good one, BTW) is that when the captured city (CC) disappears, the enemy's cultural borders usually expand in the direction of that city. So, you can't always build a new city in the place you desire.

However, you can anticipate this to a certain extent by growing a new city at the same time you starve the CC, providing you can find a suitable site at least two tiles away.

As for competing with other civs from newly "cleansed" territory, the resultant jumble of cities makes easy pickings on the edge of your empire, as they are probably hard for the other civ to supply.

This raze-and-rebuild strategy is especially attractive, since the AI doesn't seem to build in optimal locations, so a little rearranging is definitely desirable.

Thanks for the nugget about Recycling increasing yield from sold improvements!

[Fitz]

Given that you are almost certainly already at war with them, I don't think that slapping down another city inside their borders (and thus declaring war) is too big a problem, especially since you are doing it to advance your borders so yer armies can take them out.

[Aeson]

I have never seen a culture flip on the first turn. Usually my civs have decent culture, but playing mostly at deity I'm never one of the leaders until late in the game. I've conquered 1000's of cities in 7 months of playing, never once lost one to a flip on the first turn.

Can a city flip while it is still in resistance?

Yes they definitely can. Resistors count double in the number of foreign nationals part of the culture flip equation IIRC.

[Purple]

Originally posted by Fitz
Given that you are almost certainly already at war with them, I don't think that slapping down another city inside their borders (and thus declaring war) is too big a problem, especially since you are doing it to advance your borders so yer armies can take them out.

You're right, of course. I was thinking of an instance where a third (friendly) civ was in the neighborhood. When I razed my enemy's city, the third guy's borders expanded into the area I wanted to build in myself.

Building new cities inside another civ's cultural borders is very satisfying, whether to initiate a war or as part of an ongoing military campaign.