Spite and Malice....

[Harovan]

Originally posted by GhengisFarb
I didn't say you were MENTALLY damaged, I said emotionally damaged.............

My bad, replace mentally with emotionally in my statement. Not that it matters much, since both are not the case.

[Theseus]

/me applauds H_E in general.

[UnOrthOdOx]

Originally posted by BigFree
Even though I was not around at the time; I see no problem wit this Treaty/Deal. If RP didn't want you snooping around their terr, that's their business. If you didn't want to accept the terms as they were presented, then you should have declined or offered to compromise/renegotiate. Moaning about it now does little good; perhaps you should have moaned when the deal was presented?

There's the whole problem right there. RP saw it as THEIR territory.

RP claimed all of southern Bob. No exploration, no settling, nothing. No one allowed south of Sargosa. It was unclaimed territory, we were scouting, that is all, but RP, despite it being UNCLAIMED, arbitrarily claimed it as their own without anything aproaching a boarder agreement with us.

This could have been overlooked and forgotten, yes, but several members of RP then went out onto OTHER FORUMS and began to brag about how well they were able to manipulate GoW. How well they were able to dupe and deceive us. THAT is when it became a problem that stayed in the back of GoW's mind.

[GhengisFarbâ„¢]

The Treaty both sides agree to was that our Warrior was to go north of their city Madrid.

After that was agreed to and WE FULFILLED our end of the bargain by getting there, Togas decided he didn't want to fulfill his end of the bargain and said that they then wouldn't do their part for another six turns. Saragossa was never part of the agreed to treaty it was just an excuse Roleplay used to drive the knife in a little deeper and wiggle it around some.

Historical side note. The Saragossa thing right here, that is the point at which ND and GoW made a pact to wipe Lux and Roleplay off the continent. Right there, that was the straw that infuriated both teams to the point that they realized Roleplay wasn't a rational team and could never be a fair trading partner. From that point on both teams began planning the invasion and building the invasion troops.

It was the nonfulfillment of an agreed to treaty with GoW and the founding of a city smack in the middle of ND's lands. This current conflict is the War of Saragossa.

[Panzer32]

There, thats better. Real conversation/debate about the reasons for the war

Not flames.

[UnOrthOdOx]

Madrid, Saragosa, whatever, SOME RP city or another.

Personally I was more upset over the taking it over to other forums.

[GhengisFarbâ„¢]

Originally posted by GhengisFarb
This current conflict is the War of Saragossa.

It just took us awhile to get our troops built up.

Actually, I think the timing had to do with many factors:
1) The ND/GoW Alliance had just gotten Chivalry which allowed both of us to build our UUs and thus trigger our GAs to continue the war. (The second wave is REALLY scary looking. But, then Roleplay and GS will see that in REAL soon. He He, our first inter-land mass war. Voxia for the Voxians!)

2) GS had just consolidated their whole land mass meaning that once they cultivated it they would be able to go toe to toe with any two civs in the game outside of Lego. Splitting Bob between ND and GoW would restore the balance of power between GS/ND/GoW.

3) GS had just finished the war with Vox so we had hoped they wouldn't want another one right now. We reasoned they would want to consolidate and build infrastructure while Big Bob's civs tore each other apart.


As it turned out GS stuck their nose in it, kept pushing GoW to see how far they could twist the treaty before we defended ourselves and the rest is history.

[Arrian]

GS had just consolidated their whole land mass meaning that once they cultivated it they would be able to go toe to toe with any two civs in the game outside of Lego. Splitting Bob between ND and GoW would restore the balance of power between GS/ND/GoW

Anyone who has access to our map (everyone, at this point, IIRC) knows this is a joke.

-Arrian

[GhengisFarbâ„¢]

Originally posted by Arrian
Anyone who has access to our map (everyone, at this point, IIRC) knows this is a joke.

I don't have access to your map. Want to send it to me so I can be in this so-called yet highly suspect "joke?"

[Arrian]

I was under the impression that our map had been traded around to the other teams. Not so?

And it is a joke. Bob is *HUGE* compared to Stormia, and has better terrain.

Somebody (Nathan?) tried to figure out the best we could do if we just turtled on Stormia, and Bob went to war, resulting in 2 Bobian civs. I think the result was we could get up to 70% of the commerce (due to lots of coastal tiles) and about 50% of the production... of EITHER Bobian civ.

In other words, we wouldn't have much of a shot at winning. We could most likely avoid being conquered, but that isn't winning. That's not losing.

-Arrian

[DeepO]

Those numbers were with an ideally placed palace / FP... and how are we going to place those without (a) leader(s)?

DeepO

[Arrian]

Hence the "best we could do" part of my post. That was the *optimal* GS situation, if we turtled.

In other words, we would have been screwed.

-Arrian

[GhengisFarbâ„¢]

Originally posted by DeepO
Those numbers were with an ideally placed palace / FP... and how are we going to place those without (a) leader(s)?

DeepO

I thought you got a Leader for killing MadKing Donegeal?

Either put up or shut up. Its all just BS till I see a map.

[DeepO]

GF, check your forum. GoW has received a map after the Voxian war. And we got a leader for killing some Voxian mortal, yes, but how do you think Sun Tsu got rushed in 1 turn? We didn't had former Voxia yet, or the choice would have been obvious.

DeepO

[Panzer32]

Ghengis, look at the save please.