Do You Miss ZOC?

[Alex]

Civ3 ZOC is better, maybe improved by Jaybe's idea.

[Stuie]

Originally posted by Jaybe
Also, I sure wish that Coastal Forts weren't dependent on ZOC's: They should fire any time an adjacent coast is ENTERED, and if the ship stays during your turn, it takes ANOTHER shot!

As is, I don't even bother building Coastal Forts. When I did build them, I never saw one fire on an enemy ship.

As for ZOC, the Civ3 implementation is satisfactory for my taste.

[Acererak]

Originally posted by Stuie


As is, I don't even bother building Coastal Forts. When I did build them, I never saw one fire on an enemy ship.

I've never seen my coastal forts shoot at passing AI ships, but I'm pretty certain my ships have been shot at by other human player's coastal forts, since a few of my ships took damage just passing by a fellow player's city (they were privateers).

[SpencerH]

Entering a square under enemy ZOC should cost 1MP independent of rail or roads. That penalty should be in addition to the potential for HP loss while moving from one enemy ZOC to another enemy ZOC.

These types of rules were used successfully by board wargamers for years with much more complex warfare models than any CIV title.

[Bambul]

I remember originally that Firaxis said that ZOC would be improved in Civ3 by not allowing all units to exert a ZOC. eg. a warrior would not be able to stop a tank, but an infantry would.

I would like to see fortresses (plus maybe cities) have a ZOC Civ2 style, with perhaps the control mentioned above. I see it as a fortress allowing the units within it to "occupy" all the 8 tiles surrounding it by providing them with a forward base of operations. So a unit wanting to pass through *any* of those 9 tile into another must first eliminate the units within the fortress as moving into one of those tiles would effectively be attacking a unit within the fortress, ie. they quickly make a defensive position in the tile which would have been moved into. Once there are no units left, opposing units can move through freely. "Fast" units would still do their 1 damage if successful in hitting a unit that moves by.

Atleast give players an option over which ZOC to have. I'm sure the programming wouldn't be an overburdening thing, it's not like I'm asking for something really big or anything.

And coastal fortesses need a major improvement, SAM's too. They've got potential, but little practical use.

[Harovan]

If it wasn't for the AI not effectively using it, I'd like to have Civ2 ZOC back and additionally the infinite RR movement removed (perhaps reduced to 10 tiles, may be even map size dependent).

[Alex]

Originally posted by Sir Ralph
(...) additionally the infinite RR movement removed (perhaps reduced to 10 tiles, may be even map size dependent).

[Dinner]

I miss the old zone of control. I liked how You could trap enemy units plus the whole thing just kind of made sense.

[Mad Bomber]

Originally posted by Sir Ralph
If it wasn't for the AI not effectively using it, I'd like to have Civ2 ZOC back and additionally the infinite RR movement removed (perhaps reduced to 10 tiles, may be even map size dependent).

I wouldn't complain if they made this an alternative option, but if they make this a default rule I will be seriously IRATE RR's are one of the mechanics of CIV 3 that work, it would be a shame to change it IMO.

[Powerslave]

Let's face it... Civ 3 implemention of ZOC is better than Civ 2. What troubles me is that the Civ game still does not have supply rules for units. If you would have to trace a supply line to your armies then ZOC would be much more important as you can't trace unguarded supply lines through enemy ZOCs.

[SpencerH]

Civ3 ZOC of control is obviously different from civ2, but I wouldnt say better. The first time a bunch of chinese riders move through a gap in your line of mech inf to attack a city 9 squares in the rear (over captured chinese roads) you may feel differently. Lines of supply would help the problem.

[alva]

Originally posted by Mad Bomber


I wouldn't complain if they made this an alternative option, but if they make this a default rule I will be seriously IRATE RR's are one of the mechanics of CIV 3 that work, it would be a shame to change it IMO.

Ahh c'mmon, that's what kill the game of IMO, the moment RR start to appear, my goes interest goes downhill very fast.

But back on topic...

[Panag]

hi ,

CIV III style

have a nice ZOC day

[gnome]

I prefer a different blend of Civ2 and Civ3 style... the army cannot be prevented from actually moving into the square... but free shots apply (with fortresses and fast units)... and the army cannot PROCEED past that square.

The purpose is so that an army posted along a border could sight an enemy army approaching and move to intercept it. The unit is stopped (after its first move) in order to give the other unit a chance to attack. But if they fail to attack, or do not destroy the unit, the unit can move on.

So basically it slows the units without actually blocking them. That's how I would do it.

[FNBrown]

I think the poll needs more options. The ZOC system needs improvement for it to be an effective tactic, but I don't know if reverting completely to the Civ2 (or SMAC) model is the answer.