quick question about theory of evolution

[Inverse Icarus]

i'm in my first game of civ since ive been here at uni... anyway, i'm 6 turns away from completeing the ToE, and it's 6 turns until i discover Replaceable Parts.

so, which will happen first? will the wonder be built, or will i get the tech?

it'd be a huge waste if i just got replaceable parts as a free tech.

if i don't get an answer soon i'll just speed up replacable parts by a turn or something...

[Theseus]

You can do finish the research on the same turn, netting you 3 techs.

[Inverse Icarus]

k, thanks

[Alantus]

I'm no expert but past experience leaves me to believe it could go either way. Your going to learn replaceable parts when the city that will give you enough science takes its turn. If that city comes after the wonder building city your gonna get hosed. I would speed up the tech a turn or slow down the wonder a turn just to be safe. Well I would stop researching most likely and rake in the cash unless I already had piles of it.

Alantus

[DRoseDARs]

My advice, echoing Alantus, is to slow the ToE down so that it is built one turn AFTER you discover you rnext tech, in this case Replaceable Parts.

[Theseus]

That's the way I used to do it to, but this issue got settled on another thread... research comes before building, so it's OK.

[Catt]

The nature of the order of tasks within each "turn" assures you that you will always get the tech discovery before the building project completes - put simply, the game checks for science discoveries before it checks city by city for build completions, disorder, flipping, WLTKD, etc. You can verify this in any game just by watching when you discover a tech -- you will always be prompted for the next research project before being directed to the first city task.

Nonetheless, it is wise to be careful. If you don't have a decent tech lead, another civ could discover Replaceable Parts before you, devaluing the tech, and making you get it earlier than ToE (no big deal - a turn or two of 0% research). More problematic would be that a city or two goes into disorder or falls out of WLTKD, or perhaps enough pollution starts popping up to deprive your overall civ of just enough gold to reach Replaceable Parts in X turns, and you instead reach it in X+1 turns.

I just had a spot of pollution screw up a pre-build a game ago, but thankfully it was a solar plant for a SS part and not ToE -- pollution caused a worker to move from a mined grassland to a mined mountain -- the few extra shields from the mountain made my solar plant complete on that very turn, even though the previous turn had indicated that the solar plant had "2" more turns to go. Not nearly as painful as finishing ToE while 1 turn from a new discovery would be.

Catt

[Alantus]

I'm amazed (off topic)

Now I took a break from playing Civ3 from January till about 3 weeks ago, I was rather into playing Warcraft 3 from beta test until it got really boring. Since I patched Civ3 (very nice patch IMHO) and started reading Apolyton again and thinking about Civ3 way too much 1 thing keeps coming to my mind.

I am so amazed at the detail you people have gathered on the game! I guess that is what it takes to play at the 2 highest levels. I haven't been reading Apolyton THAT much but I keep reading wild stuff from the experts. It would be so cool to sit down and watch Catt or Zachriel or some of these others play civ for 8 hours. Clearly the way I go about doing things is a far cry from the way the studs do it.

Thanks for all the information.

Alantus

[Destroyer]

Im sure that when I got the same situation, I only got one free tech.

[Theseus]

Alantus, join in on the AU games. We are consciously trying to lay out a lot of the details and mechanics of the game (especially early).

[Thrawn05]

Originally posted by DRoseDARs
My advice, echoing Alantus, is to slow the ToE down so that it is built one turn AFTER you discover you rnext tech, in this case Replaceable Parts.

Why not just decrease science spending?

If your going to get 2 free techs in 6 turns might as well cut down spending and show me the money (damn cliches).

[Catt]

Re: I'm amazed (off topic)

Originally posted by Alantus
I am so amazed at the detail you people have gathered on the game! . . . . It would be so cool to sit down and watch Catt or Zachriel or some of these others play civ for 8 hours.

You'd probably be bored to tears watching Catt play - I've heard he's a good guy, but I've also heard he plays more for fun than for optimally exploiting every advantage at his disposal - to truly "play up" to all the detailed knowledge and tactics available in the forums would require a great deal of attention to detail and micromanagement - there are plenty of players who both enjoy that more than Catt, and are also better than him regardless of the level of micromanagament, and there are still plenty of others who know more about the ins-and-outs of the game functions. In fact, I suspect that he gathers most of his game knowledge from Apolyton and CivFanatics - I hear he spends at least as much time surfing the forums as he does playing the game, because he can surf (but not play) at work .

On the other hand, I'd join you in watching Zachriel play if he provided his immersive game commentary (a la his GOTM reports) in real time .

As Theseus said - you should join in on the AU games - they're a great deal of fun -- everyone plays the same game (on different levels according to the player's desire), no rules, no scoring, no contests, no timelines / deadlines - just fun and sharing the stories of the game. Now all of the AU players (experienced and inexperienced) have started sharing specific tips / insights that are neatly illustrated during the game and that others might have missed. You get to learn a little, maybe teach a little, and certainly have a little fun.

Catt

[vmxa1]

As was said you will get the research first, but if you are worried, why not up the research to get it in sooner. Just wait till it is 3 turns to go and set it for 2 turns. I try to make sure I have all the junk ones done before it comes such as Commie/Spy any left from prior era. I just trade or buy them. A few lux will get them. I hate to get a 4 turn tech with the ToE.

[Catt]

Originally posted by vmxa1
I hate to get a 4 turn tech with the ToE.

They changed it a patch or two ago - now you always get to pick the two free techs that you want (right after the pop-up says "XXX has completed Theory of Evolution" your science advisor pops up to say "We've discovered the secrets of XXX (whatever you're currently researching) - what shall we research next?" - you pick the next free tech you want from the drop down, and your science advisor goes through the routine again.)

Catt

[DRoseDARs]

Quote Thrawn05:
Why not just decrease science spending?

If your going to get 2 free techs in 6 turns might as well cut down spending and show me the money (damn cliches). End Quote.

That's just how I've always done it since the original Civilization. Discover a new tech, next turn complete ToE and get two more. This ensures without a doubt that I do not get screwed out my science beakers by the ToE completing at nearly the same time as a tech, except for a very small few between the now-researched new tech and a completed ToE on the next turn. It's a minimal loss I'm always willing to take. As far as having the money...by the time I'm to ToE, money is not a great concern 'cause I try not to rush build anything unless ABSOLUTELY neccessary, like completing a defensive unit prior to the arrival of an enemy at the city gates.