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Back to topic :Napoleon did not conquer Vietnam - the French only settled in Indochina in the mid-late 19th century.
So for discussion / poll on Napoleon vs. Joan vs. others, just go to this thread
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Back to topic :
Napoleon did not conquer Vietnam - the French only settled in Indochina in the mid-late 19th century.
So for discussion / poll on Napoleon vs. Joan vs. others, just go to this threadSi vis pacem, para bellum (9 mm) -
OT: Napoleon was cool.
Such a pity he decided to send an army of over 300,000 to rot in Spain doing NOTHING.
They had only to fight a British force of about 50,000, and the remains of the Spanish army, but they failed. Alas. That and he didn't plan his supply as well as he should have for his invasion of Russia... he had enough rations for 500,000 troops for 3 months in one depot, but he had no way of moving those up to the front... gahhhh. I won't make the same mistake in my game as France.
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Vietnam discussion got started when statement was made about America 'losing in Vietnam" earlier. This is the typically ignorant, revisionist stuff being taught in public schools today and I just wanted to set the record straight. America never 'lost' Vietnam, the American people decided it just wasn't worth the lost lives of our soldiers anymore and instead decided to just 'give it up.' I judge this as neither morally right or wrong, just the fact of what happened. The French, on the other hand, DID lose in Vietnam, surrounded and routed in the 50's. 'Nuff said.Originally posted by Alanus
Back to topic :
Napoleon did not conquer Vietnam - the French only settled in Indochina in the mid-late 19th century.
So for discussion / poll on Napoleon vs. Joan vs. others, just go to this thread
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No I think he meant to make sure there were more even distribution between males and females.Originally posted by Andrew Cory
Wait! They wanted to be Politicaly Correct _and_ sex up the game?!?! this might be the single stupidest thing you have ever said...Comment
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And that is being Politically Correct.Originally posted by High Lord J
No I think he meant to make sure there were more even distribution between males and females.
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Perhaps... but defineatly not historically correct...Originally posted by Coracle
And that is being Politically Correct.
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America may not have lost the war in Vietnam, but Vietnam certainly won.Originally posted by FrankBullit
America never 'lost' Vietnam, the American people decided it just wasn't worth the lost lives of our soldiers anymore and instead decided to just 'give it up.'
Britain didn't lose the American Revolution, they just made a strategic withdrawal. We still celebrate Independence Day in the U.S., though.Comment
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Actually... Britain did officially lose. After Cornwallis surrendered at Yorktown, Britain admitted defeat to the American and French forces on September 3rd 1783 with the Treaty of Paris.Originally posted by Zachriel
Britain didn't lose the American Revolution, they just made a strategic withdrawal. We still celebrate Independence Day in the U.S., though.Comment
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Riiiight... We celebrate the day we signed the declaration of independance, not the day it was granted.Originally posted by Zachriel
America may not have lost the war in Vietnam, but Vietnam certainly won.
Britain didn't lose the American Revolution, they just made a strategic withdrawal. We still celebrate Independence Day in the U.S., though.
Hell, we don't even celebrate the day we _declared_ indepenance. 2 days earlier, on 2 July 1776, congress voted to declare independance. It took 2 days to write and edit a draft stating this, but the deed was done on the 2nd...
And _now_ you know!Do the Job
Remember the World Trade CenterComment
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Of course they lost! And then waited the requisite 20+ years to cancel the treaty.Originally posted by Trip
Actually... Britain did officially lose. After Cornwallis surrendered at Yorktown, Britain admitted defeat to the American and French forces on September 3rd 1783 with the Treaty of Paris.
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Well, the U.S. did wait 29 turns to declare war again, so I suppose everything works out right.
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I'm sorry, 29 what? You can't talk Civ on this thread! Someone get a moderator, we have a guy going OFF TOPIC here...Originally posted by Trip
Well, the U.S. did wait 29 turns to declare war again, so I suppose everything works out right.
*grin*Do the Job
Remember the World Trade CenterComment
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*Banned*
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Originally posted by FrankBullit
America never 'lost' Vietnam, the American people decided it just wasn't worth the lost lives of our soldiers anymore and instead decided to just 'give it up.'
The French, on the other hand, DID lose in Vietnam, surrounded and routed in the 50's. 'Nuff said.
It's a pity to read such understatements. The Americans, what are obviously smarter than the French, have been kicked out of Vietnam just like the French before.
Another way to say it : The French, after Dien Bien Phu in 1954, made a strategic withdrawal to preserve lives and their interests.
Si vis pacem, para bellum (9 mm)Comment
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Facts are a funny thing, they get in the way of ignorance. The French forces were surrounded near Dien Ben Phu and surrendered when their vaunted artillery was found to not be able to hit the surrounding heights they were being attacked from. The French artillery commander committed suicide over this.
The French appealed to the U.S. just before collapse for air attacks. The U.S. declined, the key Senator voting against being one Lyndon Baines Johnson. He would later brood over Kha Sahn noting the parallel.
The United States, however, were never in danger of imminent military collapse and could have stayed in Vietnam indefinately, if not for the collapse of support at home. Therefore, the U.S. did not suffer a military defeat as the French did, they left. Nothing 'stragetic' about it, since thier forces were not going to be overrun. Its called History, read some of it.
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