Civ III is too simple

[Deornwulf]

In looking at all of the complaints of the critics and considering my on faults with the game, I have come to the conclusion that the whole problem is that the game has become too simple. At least, that is the stock answer for the 'why' of many of the features of the current evolution of the Civ games.

Take for example the governments - why only 5? Is it because human kind only has 5 basic ways of running things or that is all that the designers felt like programming?

Resources - Could they have included more? Were copper and sugar any less important to the development of civilization than iron and bauxite (aluminum)?

Advisor screens - Do they really contain all of the information I need to know? What about what I want to know?

The list goes on and on. Some of these features I and others want might seem like micromanagement but maybe we like that aspect of the game. So much seems to have been done to the game in terms of making it easier to play that it has made it a boring, repetitive exercise in mouse clicking.

[Dom Pedro II]

Heh... well, of all the complaints I've seen, I've never seen anybody saying it was too SIMPLE. I've observed most Civ veterans complaining that there's just too much extra stuff, which is essentially the opposite.

I would agree that some things are too much, and other things I feel were not taken to their full potential.

[Jaguar]

I agree with you, however I think that the AIs need to be smart enough to challenge the human without too much cheating. The more thngs you have, the worse the AI is at using them. I think Civ3 is balanced, an they should try to make equal improvements on both AI and extras in Civ4 if it is made.

[Pyrodrew]

The more thngs you have, the worse the AI is at using them.

Artillery is a perfect example. These only benefit the human player currently & the AI has NO idea how to use them at all. What puzzles me is why would they program the AI to build these (and not just a few) if it doesn't know how to use them correctly?

I would prefer more options in the random world generator, mulitplayer or a complete Civ editor rather than simply more stuff. More options in the random world editor means new worlds to explore, new challenges to face, and more/less surprises/randomness. A complete Civ editor would allow for scenarios, ease to add units,improvements,wonders,whatever the individual desires without crashes or bugs messing up the F6 screen. Multiplayer is the ultimate challenge.

[Sarxis]

I agree that the game is just to simple.

I prefer to say it has a 'thin' feel to it.

[Coracle]

Too "simple"??

I can list about 80-90 complaints, but that would not have been one of them.

Perhaps you mean "TOO SIMPLEMINDED"? And if you doubt that just look at the mindless - and very short - list of military units and their idiotic values.

My favorite Firaxis idiocy is War Elephants who can be airlifted!!

[Cookie Monster]

Civ3 is too simple in that all it is about is war war war.

Check out the scoring system. A lot of it has to do with how much territory you control. What better way to get more territory than by waging war against your neighbors?


Jaguar Warrior:

Your avatar is offensive. As an american I am insulted by how you portray the USA as Israel's puppet. Take a close look at your avatar and you will see that you are not supporting israel. You are showing the whole world what a bunch of losers the usa is because it is controlled like a puppet by israel. Boo................

[Ming]

Originally posted by Haupt. Dietrich
Jaguar Warrior:
Your avatar is offensive. As an american I am insulted by how you portray the USA as Israel's puppet. Take a close look at your avatar and you will see that you are not supporting israel. You are showing the whole world what a bunch of losers the usa is because it is controlled like a puppet by israel. Boo................

Many people find many people's avatar's offensive. If you have a complaint, you can PM the Admin about it... And not try to start a flame war by bringing it up here. Stick to the topic, or take it somewhere else.
(By the way, I'm an American and I have no problem with it... I've seen far worse)

[Rasputin]

I beleive Civ 2 was more about war than civ 3 , I have now played my last 4 games without ever starting a war and winning cultural victories everytime. This was impossible in Civ 2 ...

[The Rook]

Originally posted by Coracle
Too "simple"??

My favorite Firaxis idiocy is War Elephants who can be airlifted!!

Didn't you see "Operation Dumbo Drop?"

[Ogie Oglethorpe]

This is my chief complaint of the game. It is very very simple. It is stripped of features in order to allow a competitive AI.

IMHO, this has been the downfall of the series. It represents a large step backwards in order to please and meet the desires of the CIV fans clamoring for a decent challenge. Prob is that challenge is only one component of the immersibility and replayability factor. The bells and whistles extra units, facilities, t-forming options, government types, etc. are as much if not more of a draw as the challenge of the AI.

I also think that this is the root of most of the dissention. The game does not (IMHO) have long term replayability as the stripped down game is most likely a poor vehicle for MP and Comparison gaming. May have one of the better AI's but so does Big Blue (but I really don't wanna play chess either some may but for me I find it boring).

[bobbyd1947]

Originally posted by Rasputin
I beleive Civ 2 was more about war than civ 3 , I have now played my last 4 games without ever starting a war and winning cultural victories everytime. This was impossible in Civ 2 ...

You're the first person here who has claimed to win cultural victories without starting a war. I'd be interested in knowing the particulars. What level do you play on? How do you expand fast enough and still build the early wonders? Do you choose particular civilizations as your computer opponents?

[PatLasch]

I've won an occ game through culture a few times without declaring war. War's usually declared on me when I won't give literature up. I start building the great library, scale down my science, and use the savings to support a bunch of spearman. Then I usually get a leader or two out of it to rush build the next few wonders. I've gotten up to four leaders within twenty turns. I love having war declared on me in occ games. Easy leaders!

[Saurus]

Re: Civ III is too simple

Originally posted by Deornwulf
In looking at all of the complaints of the critics and considering my on faults with the game, I have come to the conclusion that the whole problem is that the game has become too simple. At least, that is the stock answer for the 'why' of many of the features of the current evolution of the Civ games.

Take for example the governments - why only 5? Is it because human kind only has 5 basic ways of running things or that is all that the designers felt like programming?

Resources - Could they have included more? Were copper and sugar any less important to the development of civilization than iron and bauxite (aluminum)?

Advisor screens - Do they really contain all of the information I need to know? What about what I want to know?

The list goes on and on. Some of these features I and others want might seem like micromanagement but maybe we like that aspect of the game. So much seems to have been done to the game in terms of making it easier to play that it has made it a boring, repetitive exercise in mouse clicking.

I agree.

There is a lot of choises at the beginning of the game but
after the beginning of the Industrial age there is just war and
more war. No room for a builderminded player as there simply is nothing to build - except for another tank or battleship.
Witch is even worse is that by forcing player to build battleship after battleship there are soon millions of units to micromanage
and so the tedious endgame is a reality.

-Saurus

[AJ Corp. The FAIR]

Haupt. Dietrich, Ogie Oglethorpe and Saurus reflect my thoughts.

The focus on warring makes the game (sometimes) so boring predictable ... They've even managed to spoil the science concept
(I'm sure though they'll fix this ): don't bother researching yourself anymore (emperor/deity).

Maybe that's the reason why so many players don't finish their games. I've only finished TWO of them. And I must have played around 40/50 games I suppose ...

Sad. I've also experienced that i sometimes don't care about reloading a