I have a ghost!

[Dr Strangelove]

OK, so I'm a greedy warmonger! Big Deal! So sue me! Yes turns take a long time because there are a lot of units, but you know something? It's my business if I like it that way. I occasionally have minor slow downs wherein the computer takes 4 or 5 seconds deciding what to do, but otherwise my system handles it well.

Build the spaceship? Been there, done that in a previous game. You know what the problem with winning the game via the space race is? It's repetitive and boring.

I like winning by conquest. You're amazed that I haven't overrun the whole world? Well remember that even modern armor can advance no more than two spaces into enemy territory if they're to have any movement left to use on an attack and that usually they can attack only one unit at a time. In this version of civ there isn't any super- Blitz in which a dozen or so tanks can rollover numerous cities in an enemy country laced with railroads in only one or to turns.

Well you guys have at least verified that the problem is a bug. I wasn't aware of the "crash when destroying a settler in a ship bug". Does this bug happen to everyone, or just to select systems? Does it only happen when the last ship and settler of a civ is destroyrd, or does it happen at any point of the game.

I would still appreciate some more constructive advice on how to work around this bug. I simply don't want to take the build the spaceship dive.

Has anyone won the game via total conquest?

[Ethelred]

Originally posted by Arrian
Ethelred,

I hope you either have a very fast computer or a lot of patience. Marla's map, while beautiful, is utterly huge, and slows down badly (at least on my computer).building. By the early industrial age, there was a 45 minute wait between turns. I couldn't take it anymore. Good luck.
-Arrian

My PC was fast a year ago. A PIII 700 is not fast anymore. I delibertly went down to Regent difficulty in hopes the AI wouldn't be able to build enough units. I chose Rome and when I saw the capitals of France and Germany nearly cheek to jowl I decided that if I do play it out it will be as a mad dog warmonger from hell. Just to cut down on the number of active civs.

I believe you about the 45 minute wait. The first turn took a suprisingly long time. Not irritating but not confidence enducing either.

I doubt I will try it though. I am currently trying to get my first Emperor win. I need to quit looking at other peoples saves.

[Ethelred]

Originally posted by Dr Strangelove
OK, so I'm a greedy warmonger! Big Deal! So sue me! Yes turns take a long time because there are a lot of units, but you know something? It's my business if I like it that way.

I didn't say otherwise. I made it clear that YOU were not one of the people *****ing. I was just saying I didn't understand why people did that AND *****ed. Or played that way either but thats a matter of taste and tolerance for tedium.

Build the spaceship? Been there, done that in a previous game. You know what the problem with winning the game via the space race is? It's repetitive and boring.

Only if you play on a low level like you were doing. If you play on level where the AI has a chance it can get very close. Once I won by one single turn.

Now that was nervous time. Had to hustle up some trades for tech and aluminum to pull it out. Nevertheless you are welcome to play the way you want. I was simply suggesting a simple way to get around the problem.

I like winning by conquest. You're amazed that I haven't overrun the whole world?

Well frankly yes. Although the real question was why were ALL the civs still there if you were playing for conquest or domination. Especially with the corruption mod you made. Even as a builder I often take out one civ early.

I have played two games on Chieftain since my first game. One was a game of the month someone put on Yahoo and the other was an experiment to see why so many were having trouble finishing on chieftan before 2050. In both games I easily took out a civ before anyone even had iron working except me. Did it in the first game because I didn't want the Romans to get legionaires. Who knew? As soon as I took out their last city they respawned WITH three legionaires. They tried beelining for my nearest city. Took them by pecking at them with horsies. Had to wipe out the Romans twice.

Second game, that was a GOTM on Yahoo, the Babs in fit of stupity decided I was their target. So much for the Babs. It was quite awhile before I wiped out anyone else. One civ went when I got Cavarly and another when I got tanks. I had no interest in a conquest game. I was trying to see how quick I could launch and more territory improved my research speed but only till the corruption limit is reached.

Turned out the guy that set the game up had neglected to tell anyone that he had turned of ALL victory conditions. All six. Leaving a game that had to be played to 2050 for score. So I edited the game. It was very annoying to get the Appollo Program Wonder and then find that I couldn't build a Space Ship. Thats when I downloaded Gramphos' save game editor.

I like the space win because its the only win with a movie. Also it was the traditional way of winning in the two previous versions of Civ.

Well you guys have at least verified that the problem is a bug. I wasn't aware of the "crash when destroying a settler in a ship bug". Does this bug happen to everyone, or just to select systems? Does it only happen when the last ship and settler of a civ is destroyrd, or does it happen at any point of the game.

That bug only happens if a civ gets wiped out while it has a settler on a ship. For some reason the game gets screwed up if you try to sink the ship. That why I thought it was EXTRA odd that you were able to sink the ship without crashing the game. I know that Firaxis has been given saves of unmodded games that had this occur. Its been mentioned here a number of times.

I would still appreciate some more constructive advice on how to work around this bug. I simply don't want to take the build the spaceship dive.

You had all the victory conditions turned on according the save game editor. So you can go for a domination win. I think conquest is right out unless you can edit the Japanese out of the game without messing it up.

Switch to Republic if you can't end the war with the Japanese. Maybe even to communism but then you won't be able to use that huge amount of cash to rush things. Maybe Monarchy would be better as you allready have plenty of cash.

To do that what I would build the UN to make sure no else can. You would lose the election unless you start bribing those you aren't at war with.

Finish off the Iroquois and the Egyptians. Shouldn't take long as they are small. Build a temple and maybe a library in each city you take. Just roll over them as quick as you can. Quit messing around with bombers as you don't need them against the weak defense the other civs have.

When you pick another civ to take out fill a lot of transports with modern armour only and attack them from several points. Even the infantry units won't be able to stand up to the amount of modern armour you can throw at them.

I don't see how you can win by conquest with the Japanese problem. Maybe you can as they have no cities. You can certainly win by domination. That is why I suggest rushing a temple in each city you take. Five turns later the city's border expands doubling the territory it has. Territory within your borders is the basis of a domination win.

As for the conquest question yes people have won that way. Not me as I don't try it. All but one of my games have been by Space Race. One by domination and that was a suprise. The expanding culture of conquered cities took me over the domination requirements and suddenly I won.

I think there are two ways to get a conquest win. Simply turn off all the other wins except conquest, especially the Domination win. That will leave a win by score in 2050 or the conquest win. The other is to wipe the last civs so fast your borders won't expand enough for the domination win. Razing cities can enhance that.

I hear this can make it a bit difficult to get the last cities. The AI will build settlers to fill in the gaps making the end of the game a bit of a Whack a Mole game. Quick blitzing conquests are the best way to do that I would guess. Again use transports to attack from many places at once.

Of course there is the treachery route. Bribe the victim to get a Right of Passage and then abuse it. That can make it possible to wipe out a civ in one single treacherous turn.

[Ethelred]

Weird. This place won't let you say wine.

It would help me avoid these peculiar restrictions if the preview had the CENSOR filter activated. I would have changed the words. I am not about to edit that for such a silly thing.

Really! censoring a word like that. How about the brittish spelling or a bit of slang.

Whinging or *****ing.

[Dr Strangelove]

Actually I was playing at regent level, I used the C3MT to change to chieftan when the Japanese refused to die because I thought it might help.

Does building the UN do anything towards making other civs talk to you? If I changed to allow Domination could I build the UN and talk the Japanese into making peace?

[Ethelred]

The only thing the UN does is make the election for Secretary General possible. Adds a little culture as well. Adding it back in would only give you the opportunity for the diplomtic victory. Perhaps that would apeal to your avatars real world inspiration, Dr. Henry Kissinger.

I have no idea why the Japanese don't go away when you kill the settler. I do have an idea if you have an older save of the game. From when they still had the settler on a ship. Just use that same editor to move the settler OFF the ship. I tried that with someone elses ghost civ and it worked. Remember to mark the settler as NONE in the loaded on box. Just moving him without doing that will crash the game. Then you CAN kill the settler and the Japanese will be destroyed. I am guessing that whatever you did to kill that ship without crashing the game bypassed the test for the destruction of the civ and now the test is not being made anymore.

Everyone else has had the game crash when they kill the ship. Did you leave out a couple of details?

[Dr Strangelove]

Ethelred- no I didn't leave anything out. Were the other people using WinXP? My system comes with some sort of built in crash protection, which might have prevented the crash.

My avatar is my nom de plum "Dr Strangelove" from the movie of the same name.

[Ethelred]

I don't know what OS the other where using. I tested one myself though and I use XP. It was the game crashed not XP. XP is pretty stable. Especially since I removed an old DIMM that was messing things up. For a while there I was haveing more than crash a day and half were BSODs. Not one BSOD since then. Been up for about two weeks straight now.

I know who Dr. Stranglove is. Henry Kissinger was often called Dr. Strangelove. Peter Sellers played a bunch of people in that movie. Three come to mind but for some reason I think it was six.

According to IMDB it was three. It was supposed to be four. Don't know where I got six from. Thats why I check these things. Heck the fourth part was the one Slim Pickens got. That wouldn't have been as good. I haven't seen it in a long time.

[Dr Strangelove]

Originally posted by Ethelred
ix.

According to IMDB it was three. It was supposed to be four. Don't know where I got six from. Thats why I check these things. Heck the fourth part was the one Slim Pickens got. That wouldn't have been as good. I haven't seen it in a long time.

No, I can't quite see Peter Sellers playing a crazy Texan.

[Dr Strangelove]

Well, I went back to the turn before I eliminated the last Japanese city. I made certain that I eliminated the galley before capturing the cities, and when I captured the last city the AI STILL did not recognize the end of Japan, and Japan continued to be present on the Diplomacy screen as being at war with me. Any ideas?

[steelehc]

Build 65,536 ICBMs and nuke every square on the map. This should kill any remaining Japanese units. If not, it would be highly entertaining to see an entire map whose landmass is completely covered with pollution.

Steele

[Ethelred]

Originally posted by Dr Strangelove
Any ideas?

Give up on any hope for a conquest victory. Thats about it. Very strange. Most people have been able to work around this one way or another. Japan may have been corrupted in some way before that.

It so messed up you may never be able to make peace. In which case a change of government may be in order. Monarchy or communism are both unaffected by war weariness. Both are hard on your cash flow but you may allready be at the point where you will get more money by not haveing to spend on luxuries.

The only other thing I can suggest is to try that trick you used with the settler again.

OH someone mentioned another way.

You may be able to give them a city. Peace, city, kill city. This worked for someone else. But it also worked if I moved the settler off the ship with an editor in his game.

Good Luck.

[THE INFAMOUS X]

There isn't any phantom Japanese state. The simple answer is that once you destroyed the Japanese civilization they respawned at another place on the map. The same thing happened to me. I destroyed Egypt complelety wiping them off the peninsula early on in the game, but after I destroyed the last city the civ still remained. Finally later on in the game I was able to find out their new location thanks to some map trading. They built Thebes all the way on the other side of the world from where they had been.

[Dr Strangelove]

Originally posted by THE INFAMOUS X
There isn't any phantom Japanese state. The simple answer is that once you destroyed the Japanese civilization they respawned at another place on the map. The same thing happened to me. I destroyed Egypt complelety wiping them off the peninsula early on in the game, but after I destroyed the last city the civ still remained. Finally later on in the game I was able to find out their new location thanks to some map trading. They built Thebes all the way on the other side of the world from where they had been.

No I checked this out with Civ3 Multitool. There are neither cities or units left to the Japanese.

[Dr Strangelove]

I just thought of another possibile explanation for this unusual phenomenon. I had reduced Japan to 6 cities in a previous war. I then engaged the Egyptians and Iroqouis in war. The Japanese made a mutual defense treaty with the Egyptians triggering a suicidal declaration of war by the Japanese. Could it be the continued war with the Egyptians that prevents the Japanese from disappearing?