German release/translation gaff

[Farmer Jimbo]

I'm surprised I saw this on /. and not here:

http://slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=01/11/24/1818254&mode=thread&threshold=-1

One of the funnier/ironic comments is that German Infogrames claims the translation is in an advanced state, but won't availible until March 2002. Sounds like an incredibly sucky situation all the way around.

My apologies if this info is already being discussed in another thread.

[John-SJ]

I'm sorry, I don't understand this at all. If I have this right, German players want to by an English version of the game, apply a German mod, and play the game in their native language, right?

I don't see how this can be considered a copyright infringement, they are paying for the game and then modifying text files, so who's copyright is being infringed?

Does this mean that if I buy the game and modify certain text files to be more humorous that I could get fined too? Even though anyone who wanted to use my mod would STILL have to buy the game first...

John-SJ

[TCO]

I guess mods are technically an illegal duplication of parts of the game. I would guess that another issues involved may be promises made to German distributors.

Different language versions are also useful for price discrimination. The English version game might be cheaper than the German one. (So they want to force Germans to buy the official trnaslated version to reake in more dollars.)

[Gramphos]

See this quote from the license. Note my boldtype

From Civilization III License AgreementOTHER RESTRICTIONS: You may not cause or permit the disclosure, copying, renting, licensing, sublicensing, leasing, dissemination or other distribution of the Software or the Documentation by any means or in any form, without the prior written consent of Infogrames Interactive. You may not modify, enhance, supplement, create derivative work from, adapt, translate, reverse engineer, decompile, disassemble or otherwise reduce the Software to human readable form.

According to this license is all editing of civ3mod.bic illegal, also changing the graphics and modifying them should be illegal. And this in a game made for moding.

BTW: Could someone explain what they mean with "create derivative work from"

Oh, and I cant understand why they don't allow translations to be made. If anyone could come up with a good reason...

[Farmer Jimbo]

From the scripts.txt file in the text folder:

;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;; ;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;
;
; Sid Meier's Civilization III
;
; Dialog box scripts
;
; Copyright (c) 2000, 2001 by Firaxis Games, Inc.
;
;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;; ;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;
;
; INSTRUCTIONS FOR TRANSLATORS!
;
; 1) These files must not be saved in "Microsoft Word Format", or they will
; be ruined. They MUST be saved in "Text Only" format.
;
; 2) Please do not insert extra blank lines, nor remove existing blank
; lines, as this will cause the program to malfunction.
;
; 3) But it is normally okay to turn a long line into two shorter lines;
; for instance:
;
; This is a very long sentence; it probably won't fit on one line in German.
;
; is equivalent to:
;
; This is a very long sentence; It probably
; won't fit on one line in German.

I think we have a conflict of philosophies between Infogrames and Firaxis...

[Gramphos]

Originally posted by Farmer Jimbo
I think we have a conflict of philosophies between Infogrames and Firaxis...

It might be an instruction for official translators. (But why keep them in the files that everyone can see?)

[Sparky]

I translated a reply on the German Infogrames site. I think they may have backed off.

[General Ludd]

Doesn't infogrames have plans to release a german version? if they do, they are completely justified stoping someone from doing this.

And also, if that is the case, I'd hardly call it a 'mod' piracy would probably be a more accurate term. Just like when beta versions of games are leaked out before the actual release.

[Farmer Jimbo]

Sparky: I ran the Infogrames.de site through Babelfish and I think they are tap dancing as opposed to back-peddling. Here's how I see the current situation: I group of German fans obtained a few copies English/US version. They decided to mod what they could using the built in support for translations. They contacted Infogrames.de and Firaxis and told them what they were doing. Firaxis gave them space on their server for the project as it was exactly what they designed they text file portion of the game for. Infogrames.de finally got around to reading their backlog of email and realized the financial implications of this fan mod to the Deutch version of CivIII. The project was shut down. Public critisicm followed.

Result: Deutch fans have a slim chance of getting a localized version earlier than March 2002 (ie tap-dancing).

[Jason Beaudoin]

Infogames is simply unbelievable! How could they be such idiots!? If they didn't want Kai to be translating it, why didn't they have someone there contact him and discuss it with him personally explaining why it was bad for the company? Why didn't they try to work with him?

Is there anything that we can do to support him?

[Jason Beaudoin]

Originally posted by Gramphos
See this quote from the license. Note my boldtype

According to this license is all editing of civ3mod.bic illegal, also changing the graphics and modifying them should be illegal. And this in a game made for moding.

BTW: Could someone explain what they mean with "create derivative work from"

Oh, and I cant understand why they don't allow translations to be made. If anyone could come up with a good reason...

Ok... so you found their licensing agreement... but what about Firaxis ENCOURAGING US to modify the freaking game? Huh? Couldn't we call the ENTRAPMENT? We have one gaming company telling us "ya, sure, go ahead... mess with the graphics... play with the settings... change the text if you want; then you have the publlisher telling you not to?

This is so wrong! Kai should fight this and sue them for defamation of character! He should argue to the courts that he and other fans are openly encouraged to modify the game, and he felt there was no harm in making a translation. If Kai fought this, he would win.

If a fund for his legal expenses are ever organized, I would donate cash to his cause!

[MarkG]

Originally posted by Gramphos
It might be an instruction for official translators.

it is

(But why keep them in the files that everyone can see?)

perhaps because the game uses those files?

[Gaius Marius]

Ok, I (german speaker) read the Infogrames.de announcement, and they aren't retracting anything. They say they had to take action (oddly, in the interests of Firaxis, they claim). There's some drivel about "encouraging fan modification," which doesn't make any promises or clarify any policy. Essentially, it says they reserve the right to come down with the hammer of legal action, but only when they want to.

[Mercator]

I guess we shouldn't invite Infogrames over to the Creation or Files forums then?

[TCO]

Originally posted by Gramphos


Oh, and I cant understand why they don't allow translations to be made. If anyone could come up with a good reason...

They make more money by selling seperate language versions. It enables price discrimination. (For instance if DE civers can be charged more than Americans.)