...could be the final nail in the coffin for in-house beta testing. I have always said game designers cannot make an objective test of their own work. Many of the problems could have been discovered by objective beta testing. I am not saying "open" beta testing, just testing done by someone that does not have a personal stake in the results.
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First, I agree.
Second, I think, however, these companies are just doing what the market will bear: Release a playable but buggy product and let 'the real world' do the beta testing for you. If sales suck, abandon the game. If sales are good, look at the beta test results your paying public is crawling over itself to give you and release some patches that don't require too many programming hours to implement. Leave the good stuff for an X-pack or sequel that approaches what the first release *should* have been. More $$$. Effectively, two or three or more products are sold for what the fans 'would like to have seen' in one.
While I think the words 'work in progress' as they apply to released games should be taken out back and shot, the average gamer is perhaps a step below a crack whore, so good luck getting them to change their relationships with their pimps.I've been on these boards for a long time and I still don't know what to think when it comes to you -- FrantzX, December 21, 2001
"Yin": Your friendly, neighborhood negative cosmic force.
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First, I love this game. I think this is the best game ever, and I definitely won't call it a debacle. But that's just me.
However, me too am surprised that they didn't catch some very obvious things, like air superiority bug, railroad description in civlopedia (I developed all the forest squares first in my first game because of that), city sorting, palace (the screen, but the building) bug, etc. These things are so obvious that a casual player would easily spot in his first game. I can't believe that professional game testers won't catch these and the only excuse is lousy testing.
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...the only excuse is lousy testing.I've been on these boards for a long time and I still don't know what to think when it comes to you -- FrantzX, December 21, 2001
"Yin": Your friendly, neighborhood negative cosmic force.
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if i wasn't in a pi$$y mood, then i wouldn't do it.....
Originally posted by yin26
Second, I think, however, these companies are just doing what the market will bear: Release a playable but buggy product and let 'the real world' do the beta testing for you. If sales suck, abandon the game. If sales are good, look at the beta test results your paying public is crawling over itself to give you and release some patches that don't require too many programming hours to implement. Leave the good stuff for an X-pack or sequel that approaches what the first release *should* have been. More $$$. Effectively, two or three or more products are sold for what the fans 'would like to have seen' in one.
it's not like the game with couse you injury and you need to be protected from the unscrupulous businessmenPrince of...... the Civ Mac Forum
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Re: if i wasn't in a pi$$y mood, then i wouldn't do it.....
Originally posted by d_dudy
it's called capitalism, if you don't like it, don't buy the game
it's not like the game with couse you injury and you need to be protected from the unscrupulous businessmenAny views I may express here are personal and certainly do not in any way reflect the views of my employer. Tis the rising of the moon..
Look, I just don't anymore, okay?
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No excuses
Firaxis has no excuses for not having a core of outside testers to evaluate their products. On this freaking board alone they could find 10 intelligent, intense gamers who could in 14 days have found every problem with the game and reported it prior to going gold.
What to look for in an independent tester:
1) Speak in complete sentences.
2) A flair for gaming.
3) A critical eye
4) The willingness to test cheap!
Hey, I meet all those requirements...fancy that!
Venger
P.S. I love setting my own requirements...
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While I would like to see more third-party beta testing of games, I can't honestly say the released product of CivIII upsets me that much. Yes, there are bugs, some of them rather obvious, and which should have been caught, but let's be objective. The list isn't that long.
Too many games are released with a list major bugs longer than Hitler's criminal record (so long as you get the idea, please don't flame me for the analogy). We've found several major issues, not dozens. I can deal with several, especially when the scale of the product is one is as vast as CivIII, and ESPECIALLY when the OVERALL quality of game is amazing.
These bugs are serious problems, granted, but nonetheless, I still enjoy the game -- immensely. I still stay up until 3 or 4 a.m. playing, and while corruption, and trespassing, and air superiority issues, ... etc. annoy me, I still call myself a Civ fan. So long as the patch fixes these issues, and so long as it comes out soon, I'm willing to give Firaxis, and the only development staff I've *trusted* for a decade, the benefit of the doubt -- maybe they should have done more public beta-testing, maybe they should have pushed the deadline back, maybe this and maybe that... but in the end, the bottom line is, maybe I'll go and play another turn.There is a thin line between insanity and genius. I have erased this line.
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My only worry here is what Infogrames will decide about the patching schedules. While Firaxis itself has been quite good about patching (yes, I said that), if Infogrames is running the show, we already know what they will be geared towards.I've been on these boards for a long time and I still don't know what to think when it comes to you -- FrantzX, December 21, 2001
"Yin": Your friendly, neighborhood negative cosmic force.
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Originally posted by Drake Tungsten
How did Firaxis violate any consumer protection laws? I don't think shipping a game without MP is considered a crime...
The game is buggy - imagine if the music industry released CD's with tracks missing or the drummer not playing on track 5 etc. How long do you think they'd get away with it? Its the long suffering PC game consumers who are letting them do it now but that won't last forever.Any views I may express here are personal and certainly do not in any way reflect the views of my employer. Tis the rising of the moon..
Look, I just don't anymore, okay?
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