LE scandal - Firaxians, there has to be an explanation to 75,000 customers!

[DanS]

Dan should take it as a compliment!

Maryland's DMV is downright friendly in comparison to DC's. Almost feels like walking into a Denny's...

At least he didn't tell to go talk to tech support about it.

[Fidel]

Originally posted by Yaga
La Russo, on the other hand, kindly asked for more information on contacting the Civ team, and was told the appropriate route to take so that it would get handled correctly.

I know it is not his fault. I did write to Firaxis. I do not expect to get a decent answer. I kindly asked him to ask someone over there about this scandal, as I am sure that official lines of communication will not work.

[Earthling7]

Originally posted by GP
I'm just being the "bad cop". Dan will take it with a laugh. He's not some wimp. I'll buy him a beer next time I'm at UMD...I mean DMV!

Make sure he shares your sense of humour. Ever since, and before, Civ3 came out, Firaxis has been under fire for any issues regarding the game and it's marketing. The marketing isn't theirs, altough I am surprised that they are not aware of what's going on. I would certainly be more interested (concerned) with a product I spent years developing.

So game issues are their problem, yes, but it seems we're over reacting big time. The LE seems to be a rip-off (still waiting for it ) but the game is great! It needs some tender loving care from Firaxis, it's been born, but it needs to be nurtured into a full blown product, but we are not being reasonable.

Neither Dan, Soren or any other members of the Firaxis team are forced to attend this forum. Apolyton is a small corner somewhere on the web. Sure, there are fans here, but if Civ3 sells like Civ2 did, we are just a fraction of their customers. Don't flame Dan for posting, even if he doesn't answer our questions every time. I'm sure if he answered every question to the best of his knowledge, he would no longer be working for Firaxis.

We have to be reasonable when addressing them, otherwise they will simply stop answering our questions altogether. The LE/Release Date business is an ugly one, and we should not be afraid to ask them and demand answers, but personal insults will only backfire.

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Now, will the LE buyers be treated to some nice juicy post-release goodies?

[Fidel]

so dan, what do they say back at the HQ? anyone ever prepared those notes?

[Khufu]

Now, will the LE buyers be treated to some nice juicy post-release goodies?

Methinks a proof of purchase of the LE should warrant a $15 discount on the inevitable "expansion pack", or "multiplayer edition" (insert marketing euphemism here).

[TCO]

Dan...walk down the hall...knock on Sid's door. (Don't be timid.) Ask if the designer's notes were ever written. Return with answer.

[Fidel]

i think sid shot the messenger

[scientist]

Pretty Disappointed with Infogrames

I think Civ III is a good product. A lot of the whining about various "bugs" is really symptomatic of people still playing Civ III with Civ II strategies.

I do hope that Firaxis is good enough to provide the same patch support for Civ III as they did for Sid Meier's Alpha Centauri.

But Firaxis should seriously consider reexamining its relationship with Infogrames. The LE is a joke. I bought it for the designer notes... and there are none included, though they were listed as included. The extra CD is marketing crap. Atr first I thought it might include some designer notes, but no such luck.

Remember Civil War? Now that was a game that really had some great documentation. A reference "cheat sheet", a well written manual, and a very stylish mini strategy guide. Even SMAC had a better manual and tech tree than Civ III.

I'm also rather shocked that Dan and the rest of the Firaxis crew have never even seen the LE! Really I would think that they would want to have some attachment to the finished product. I know it was in stores around me by November 1st.

Infogrames is hurting this product. I will think twice before buying another infogrames game. Unfortunately, I don't know if the shoddy Limited Edition also points to a new, worse era for Firaxis, where they try to cash in on their well-earned prestige by releasing, buggy, poorly supported products meant to milk their former fans.

I really do hope that someone from Firaxis will stop passing the buck and address this issue, before alienating 75,000 of their most devoted fans.

After All, Mr. Meier, your name is on the box.

[TCO]

Originally posted by LaRusso
i think sid shot the messenger

"On your sheild or with it"
-Spartan mothers' saying

[adaMada]

Originally posted by Khufu


Methinks a proof of purchase of the LE should warrant a $15 discount on the inevitable "expansion pack", or "multiplayer edition" (insert marketing euphemism here).

lol, spot on .

On a more personal level, I did get the LE (even worse, wasn't planning to get it, spir of the moment), but I'm not so much mad as I'd just like an explanation from Firaxis -- just some semi-official thing about what's in the box, why it's not what was promised, and if they plan to make it up to customers somehow in the future. Beyond that, though, the game still seems awsome (or will be when they de-bug and add some features), and I don't regret my purchase -- I'd just like to know why I got what I did.

-- adaMada

[scientist]

Still glad I bought it, until...

Adamada,

Like you, I'm such a civ addict that I don't really regret the purchase either. I've been too busyt playing the games to worry too much about the lack of design notes.

That is, until a BUG showed up that left a few hours of game play lost when some of my more recent saved games were corrupted and could not be read.

Hell, for a non-buggy version of civ III, I would have gladly paid the extra $10. The time I spend playing the game is worth much more to me than a few bucks.

Even so, false labeling and a buggy game are particularly galling. Worrying about having to replay the last 20 turns sort of takes the fun out the game. Now if I had my designer notes, I'd read them and just start a new game. But since they were a strike, and now this bug is a strike, Civ III now has two strikes against it.

I suspect that the programming and packaging were really a rush job at the end. I hope Firaxis and Infogrames prove me wrong.

[monkspider]

This is a noble campaign Larusso, the designer notes were, believe it or not, the main thing I was looking forward to about the LE!

[Earthling7]

As I said earlier, I think a post-release compensation would be in order. Why not get someone at Firaxis to compile some stuff, drawings etc done during the design process? They must have some kind of a designer diary (anyone remember the DinoDiaries?) they could compile into a neat little book. Proof of purchase, and they'd send if off...

So far, we haven't even hear why, as late as October, the information was so wrong...

[chris007jg]

I actually bought the le BECAUSE of the recent activity by game companies to put the manual in pdf on the cd and no anything else but the cd in the box. I also was under the impression that the stratagy guide was to be included. I know this was only rumor when I heard it and I am not complaining that it was omitted. What I am not happy with is that the game did not work on my laptop when I installed it nor on my friends new machine bought just to upgrade for civ3. yes he upgraded only to play civ3.
Anyway, I was very unhappy with the manual included and especially with the tech chart. The icons that represent everything in my mind was very very foolish. It is very hard to tell what any of them are until you just memorize it. Well hey. If i memorized it what do i need the chart for.
Basically I bought LE to get what should be included in the normal box. Not for these extra movies and stuff. Nor do i want drawing or the like after the fact. The game is what I want and what I have. Although I have never heard of a game other than fellow Microprose spinoff Imagicgames' Destiny that need a patch out of the box and had to wait for a month to get it.

[MustPost]

But Firaxis should seriously consider reexamining its relationship with Infogrames. The LE is a joke. I bought it for the designer notes... and there are none included, though they were listed as included. The extra CD is marketing crap. Atr first I thought it might include some designer notes, but no such luck.

Didn't Infogames buy Hasbro who had boughten Microprose?
I believe Infogames owns the rights to both the Civilization series of computer and board games.

Firaxis was just contracted, or sold the rights for one game to use the name Civilization III in a game.
Im not sure what kind of contract they have for an expantion game. But if a expention pack is made it, will be by Infogames choice will Infogames as the Publisher.