c185# MOO3 AND CIV3, SUPPLIES AND TACTICS

[ElmoTheElk]

Hey,

The main reason I metioned GGS, Dan, is not because of the great book, but refering to the game I and some others are developing. We often have to make the choise between realism and gameplay. They don't ALWAYS count each other out, but they (too) often do. It's not a matter of good/bad desicions, but a matter what you are designing for.

GGS is a GREAT book though, I agree.

If anyone get's curious about our game, see our forum on Apolyton.

Greetz,
Elmo

[TCO]

Originally posted by MarkG
if you do the second, i'll tolerate the first

Aaahhh....you tolerate me either way.

Gotta figure out something to write now...

[Master Marcus]

an abstracted comparison

Comrade Tribune beat me to it ( I wanted also to write about the Civ3-MoO3 thing ), and since I hate abusing the system I guess it will take some time before my first column....

I share his enthusiasm about MoO3 : read about it in the forums, here and those orbiting the official site. IF the team succeeds, it will be the best TBS ever. Something really huge and unprecedented is in the works, guys. Be prepared. The game will be extremly complex ( the most to date and by far ), and a deep learning curve. On the other hand, M. Emrich ( main designer ) told us that he always think about the newcomer, and the game is going to be very user-friendly. I only wished that CT has shared more thoughts about unique MoO3's concepts, such as the Imperial Focus Points management within the RTS battles and the overall TBS ; and why not the game's extensive civilian engine ( yep, they intended to put at least as much culture and religion in MoO3 than Civ3 ): the whole Ethos thing. Ambitious to say the least...too much ambitious and extensive that it was recently announced amongst the feature CUTS ( sounds familiar!) and kept for a MoO4 (!) or a MoO3 expansion. Hrmmmmphh

However I don't entirely share some of his skeptical thoughts about Civ3. It will be at worst a good game, most obviously a great game. I see it as a nice SMACx upgrade. A great TBS, not the savior of the TBS genre where I place my bet for MoO3, but still a great TBS. We'll see, but I'll play both and I don't expect to have the time to play anything else in 2002.

As for the comparison thing, it's almost unfair but we can't avoid it: a conservative ( although exceptional ) terrestrial Empire building game in the grand civ tradition toe to toe with a 5X space Empire-building space-opera ??????? I don't think the latter can't be lined in the tradition of its prequels (MOO,MOO2) on the contrary of Civ3, for it shows too much innovative concepts AND gameplay mechanics around the IFPs and macromanagement. In fact, my major concern about this is a forced deadline or further budget cuts....

[MosheGG]

I like the supply idea, i think that it would make the military side alot more fun.

BTW how do you get those pictures by your names. Yep i`m a new boy.

[Master Marcus]

Go to "control panel" just below Apolyton main title ( upper left ), then "Edit Options": at the end, choose an avatar.

[MosheGG]

Thanks MM

[Frugal_Gourmet]

Mega "Ugh"....

I can't imagine anything more boring than managing supply lines. It really is out-of-scope for a Civ game -- a game that already over-focuses on its war aspects.

Want to make innovation? Fine. Do something creative that adds to that grand feeling of controlling history. Don't add something that requires yet even more micromanagement and consideration.

[Tjoepie]

What is the full name of MOO3 ?

Any URL ?

[Master Marcus]

Master of Orion III.
http://moo3.quicksilver.com/main.html hours and hours of data to read in there, and don't forget the QSI posts and their crowded boards. Also in our Apolyton MoO3 forum you'll find some thoughtful posts, but not too much crowded yet... the best is yet to come.


P.S.: sorry to have short-circuited this more Civ3-oriented thread...

[Tjoepie]

Tnx a lot m8 !

[izmircali]

Supply lines could be easy and reslistic. Just make them like the trade lines in CTP. witha supply icon moving to a unit. Also make the line be limited in lengths of how far it can go from a depot. Like 5 squares in ancient, up until you have aerial resupply. It would be rather easy, you should have a toggle to see supply lines and even a game option of simple supply or advanced (for those that don't like it).

I'm tired of seeing tanks roll through the sahara or crossing deserts like they are nothing, those are challeging terrain features and logistics has always been a major concern in strategy.

it would be nice it could be as advanced as choosing to forage, depots, magazines, rolling magazines, and even some RML. But then it would be too micromanaging.

[Grumbold]

Some simple supply rules would certainly not be difficult to introduce or overwhelming to learn. Eventually a Civ game will try it out. With supply as a factor movement ranges can increase a bit to stop the current problems of trying to fight a sustained war in less than a hundred years. I know time/turn is not terribly important, but that 2020 time limit is unavoidable so it does matter somewhat how many turns a war takes.