Atari Reports Losses

[Shogun Gunner]

CMH: That comparison doesn't hold water.

Many modern companies are totally serviced oriented or deal in "information" and not assets. In a loose definition, I would put Enron and Atari in the same category. Neither own oil wells or assets (with the additional benefit of low overhead as you point out). Additionally, as you suggest in your post, companies with large cap assets is a way for a company to have something to fall back on.

If people hate every software program released by Atari, Atari's financial performance will sink like a heavy stone just like Enron did. The only thing Atari "owns" would be copyrights, trademarks, etc. to software programs (unless they have diversified into other industries - I don't really know that). Enron had contracts, financial relationships, etc. Both are paper assets. The difference is that Atari, or the companies it bought, have produced software which people like - which the consumer or investor has confidence in.

Obviously, people lost confidence in Enron, for very good reason. Stock price is a crude indicator of confidence, due to investor evaluation of the company - and it fell from record highs to worthless very quickly. The problem with Enron was illegal activities, false reporting, etc. which distorted the true financial view of the company. This is what distorted an investor's evaluation of the strength of Enron.

I believe reviewing Theseus' posts would be worthwhile. He works in that industry after all. But even a step further back would worthwhile... the reason for this thread is to discuss the future of the Civilization franchise in light of Atari's financial performance. Strong company + strong demand for Civ games = new, full featured Civ 4. I believe that is the line of this discussion.

Not trying to be funny, but talking about French and Japan bullet trains, the mafia, the Catholic church, etc. just aren't on topic. I'm with Vince, mrmitchell, et al on this - Ming has been very gracious for whatever reason, but it's really up to us to help keep to the rules and spirit of this site.

[Theseus]

@ SG

[CharlesBHoff]

Originally posted by Shogun Gunner
CMH: That comparison doesn't hold water.

Many modern companies are totally serviced oriented or deal in "information" and not assets. In a loose definition, I would put Enron and Atari in the same category. Neither own oil wells or assets (with the additional benefit of low overhead as you point out). Additionally, as you suggest in your post, companies with large cap assets is a way for a company to have something to fall back on.

If people hate every software program released by Atari, Atari's financial performance will sink like a heavy stone just like Enron did. The only thing Atari "owns" would be copyrights, trademarks, etc. to software programs (unless they have diversified into other industries - I don't really know that). Enron had contracts, financial relationships, etc. Both are paper assets. The difference is that Atari, or the companies it bought, have produced software which people like - which the consumer or investor has confidence in.

Obviously, people lost confidence in Enron, for very good reason. Stock price is a crude indicator of confidence, due to investor evaluation of the company - and it fell from record highs to worthless very quickly. The problem with Enron was illegal activities, false reporting, etc. which distorted the true financial view of the company. This is what distorted an investor's evaluation of the strength of Enron.

I believe reviewing Theseus' posts would be worthwhile. He works in that industry after all. But even a step further back would worthwhile... the reason for this thread is to discuss the future of the Civilization franchise in light of Atari's financial performance. Strong company + strong demand for Civ games = new, full featured Civ 4. I believe that is the line of this discussion.

Not trying to be funny, but talking about French and Japan bullet trains, the mafia, the Catholic church, etc. just aren't on topic. I'm with Vince, mrmitchell, et al on this - Ming has been very gracious for whatever reason, but it's really up to us to help keep to the rules and spirit of this site.

Enron asset where finicial contactor which are wallstreet side bet cannot be used to support than Bank loan the Fed
and other centeral bank rules and most state bank board in America went along with the fed ruleing( State Bank Board are not bond to follow Fed ruleing) . While other contact can be used to get bank loan. Even than world of information need real asset and goods to run. Like foods,metal,oils and engery to run. Enron accounting scandal took alot of person fund manger by surfice than they didnot unload they holding of Enron fast enought. They where to merger with than Germany energy company, it seem like the Germany company hire someone like me who have sersious doutb about Enron balance but
was unable to put their finger on what they where hideing(
this isnot unusal in accounting to think that the books are cook and not to know why). So the Germany company back out of the merger with Enron and the mess hit the fan after this. To detect cook books once must know how to cook books. Enron basely increase they earming by cooking their book to have lower expenses so they would have highter earming which fool alot of people who look at one number only back then maining earming and didnot look at the other numbers also. It the other number donot support the cooked number is than good sign that the books are cooked.

[Vince278]

Originally posted by Shogun Gunner
but it's really up to us to help keep to the rules and spirit of this site.

Well said.

[Skanky Burns]

Originally posted by Urban Ranger
Look at last year's figures. They made less than 1m net on 109m or something sales? That's less than 1%, which means they are doing worse than supermarkets. I don't know if I should or

If true, thats an extremely poor performance.
We will have to see what their figures post-christmas are.

[Argos65987]

I just have to say this is the most bizarre thread I have ever read.

[Vince278]

Originally posted by Argos65987
I just have to say this is the most bizarre thread I have ever read.

Check out the OT forum.

[Shogun Gunner]

I think this is the OT forum surging into Topic FOrums.

yes the OT is bizarre...

[Mad Bomber]

Originally posted by Urban Ranger


Bingo.

Look at last year's figures. They made less than 1m net on 109m or something sales? That's less than 1%, which means they are doing worse than supermarkets. I don't know if I should or

Man that is some SERIOUS overhead. On the otherhand, buying Atari likely cost a pretty penny as did the outrght purchase of Avlon Hill/ Hasboro. Moving the Headquarters out of France and covering losses in the employee pension fund (due to Enron, GC, MC World Com, ect) must be considered as well. In some ways it seems a minor miracle that Atari's losses were not even larger.

[CharlesBHoff]

Where did they move they headquater.

[Theseus]

Here in NYC.

Actually, though, that's not really 100% true... Atari is HQed in NYC, and Infogrames is still the French entity, and owns appr. 2/3 of Atari.

This was done as appr. 60% of total sales are in the US.

[Shogun Gunner]

oh...we are back to on topic again....good (i'm never sure when that email comes through and the subject line says "Reply to post 'Atari Reports Losses' )

That profit margin is incredible thin!!! When's the next earnings announcement due from Atari?

That stock price is pretty low... $3.65/share

[CharlesBHoff]

Originally posted by Shogun Gunner
oh...we are back to on topic again....good (i'm never sure when that email comes through and the subject line says "Reply to post 'Atari Reports Losses' )

That profit margin is incredible thin!!! When's the next earnings announcement due from Atari?

That stock price is pretty low... $3.65/share

Profit margin isnot also that inportant. The state of the world
ecomony can effect profit margin of all bussiens. Wallmark is reporting last week that Christmas sale they ecpect is at the very low end of what they want. It the global ecomony pick up the profit margin will pick up again. There is no instant recovery from than major despration we went thought, it alot
like the 1929's thought 1930 despression. You must know alittle bit of history to put thing in the propter frame. In the last Great Despression almost all big corppration that survice report negrate profit margin for afew quater before thing got better.

[Shogun Gunner]

Thanks. One of my degrees is in Economics.

...and profiy margin is one of the more important financial metrics. For proper perspective, it needs to be compared to the sector's performance, the trending over several quarters, overall sales figures, debt load + debt rating, and considered in light of the corporations strategic direction.

[Theseus]

Originally posted by CharlesBHoff
Profit margin isnot also that inportant. The state of the world
ecomony can effect profit margin of all bussiens. Wallmark is reporting last week that Christmas sale they ecpect is at the very low end of what they want. It the global ecomony pick up the profit margin will pick up again. There is no instant recovery from than major despration we went thought, it alot
like the 1929's thought 1930 despression. You must know alittle bit of history to put thing in the propter frame. In the last Great Despression almost all big corppration that survice report negrate profit margin for afew quater before thing got better.

I prefer EVA, myself... but, once again, I have no idea what you are going on about.