New traits! What will Seafaring and Agricultural do?

[Panag]

Originally posted by Yahweh Sabaoth
Even if one or two of the traits is redone, I think Atari will probably not redo too many of them, because a. that might anger the fan base that has come to identify certain civs with certain traits, and, more importantly, b. it allows for further add-on packages (à la PTW)

As for America being agricultural and industrious... this makes a lot of sense... but despite America's overwhelming agricultural output, it should be noted that current agricultural practices may leave the American breadbasket no longer functioning come the late 21st century. This principally has to do with the abandonment of crop rotation and depletion of fresh water reserves. Still, A-I for America would make a lot of sense. Industrious seems indisputable to me... this is the country, after all, for which "The Protestant Ethic and the Spirit of Capitalism" was basically written.

hi ,

conquests shall have everything from PTW , ......

lets hope the next xp shall have everything from conquests and some new stuff , .....

have a nice day

[Panag]

Originally posted by Dominae


Getting free Granaries in every city, even if they only cost 40 Shields, would still be one of the best Wonder abilities in the game. Still, you're right that Agricultural would get "shafted" with respect to one of the Wonders, and that would be a first. It would not bother me much, however.

* Dominae dreams of cheap Granaries and Industrious Workers.


Dominae

hi ,

cheap graneries and aqua's , yes , industrious workers , , there is a trait for that , .....

have a nice day

[Mad Bomber]

Seafaring is most likely to reduce the chance of sinking in tiles where the ship is not allowed (say a reduction from 50% to 25%) and perhaps a +1 movement. Half price harbors are a possibility as well.

Agricultural is likely to reduce the time for irrigating tiles and/ or bonuses to irrigated tiles. Also I would like to see Rice as a new bonus resource (in swamp)


For Seafaring:
English
America
Vikings
Carthage
Japan
Dutch and/or Portugal (if included)

for Agricultural:
China
Baylon
Persia
Iroqouis
korea
Sumeria (if Included)

[The Mad Monk]

Are we certain that swamp is in there?

[The Mad Monk]

I don't see Japan as seafaring. The Japanese were half-hearted sailors, and did not like being out of sight of land at all, in spite of being an island nation. The Chinese took sea exploration a lot futher than the Japanese.

[WarpStorm]

Originally posted by The Mad Monk
Are we certain that swamp is in there?

There are screenshots of it.

[CerberusIV]

I started thinking about which Great Wonders would the new traits be attached to.

There is a new wonder, Statue of Zeus, which sounds militaristic and religious. Assuming no GW works for more than 3 traits (except the Internet) and that each trait is linked to 5 wonders plus the Internet I came up with these ideas.

Seafaring

Colossus - in place of religious which would go to Statue of Zeus
Great Lighthouse - obvious candidate
Great Library - the GL was possible because Alexandria was a great commercial port centre so it is plausible
Magellan - again an obvious choice
SETI - because the next voyages of exploration we make will be across space

An alternative would be Newton as accurate knowledge of the movement of the planets was important for 18th century navigation

Agricultural

Pyramids - obvious
Hanging Gardens - plausible choice
Copernicus - to reflect the ancient use of astronomical observations to govern planting times for crops
Hoover - dams are used for irrigation as much as for hydroelectric power

A fifth choice isn't easy. Possibilities are Universal Suffrage reflecting the need for labour or, perhaps a better choice, either Cure for Cancer or Longevity to reflect current efforts for agricultural improvement through GM technology

Unless of course there is to be more than one new GW in Conquests?

[mrboo123]

Originally posted by zorbop
(...)might also be assured a starting location near the ocean.(..)

and maybe agricultural civs will start near rivers.

QUOTE] Originally posted by CerberusIV
(...)SETI - because the next voyages of exploration we make will be across space(...)[/QUOTE]

another idea, seafarers get cheaper space parts!

[The Mad Monk]

Originally posted by WarpStorm


There are screenshots of it.

Excellent. I wonder if they saw my suggestion...

[Naokaukodem]

Seafaring civilizations could take benefit from any sea technology they would actually reshearching for, before having discovered it yet.

I think the + 1 ships movement would be ok, same as a bonus for ship construction.

[The Mad Monk]

Interesting, but I don't think it would be good from a balance standpoint. besides, there's no way to identify a "sea technology" in a way the game would understand it, so I don't believe it's possible.

[Tiberius]

My guesses:

Agricultural:
- cheaper granaries - makes sense
- irrigate without fresh water - good when starting with lots of plains but no water, highly probable IMO
- food bonus to apply in despotism - hmm, not bad
- irrigate hills (maybe even mountains)
- bonus food in city center - highly probable, I think
- workers to irrigate faster - makes sense, but will then industr. workers lose that ability?
- more food from bad terrain (jungle, desert) - logical, but won't happen; desert tiles would become plains, civ-wise
- more food from special resources (wheat, cows) - could this be programmed ?

Seafaring:
- cheaper harbors
- cheaper ships
(the first 2 would make sense, to encourage seafaring nations to build ships)
- ships heal at sea
- faster ship promotion
- less chances for ships to sink when sailing in unknown waters (galleys on sea, caravels on ocean, etc)
(these 3 make sense, too; more powerful navies for seafaring nations is logical)
- a special ship type for seafaring nations (I don't really think this will happen)
- more troops to be transported in ships - I like it
- +1 movement for ships - too powerful;
- more food or commerce from sea tiles - too powerful; or not ?

Note: not all of them in the same time; would be overpowering.

[Naokaukodem]

Originally posted by The Mad Monk
Interesting, but I don't think it would be good from a balance standpoint.

Too powerfull or too weak?

Originally posted by The Mad Monk besides, there's no way to identify a "sea technology" in a way the game would understand it, so I don't believe it's possible.

The sea technologies would be of course pre determinated, it would be i guess Map Making, Astronomy, Navigation, Magnetism, Mass Production?... We could also modify the requiered technologies so that the features of sea ones could be enabled. Sea techs would be "available" but needed to be discovered or exchanged yet. For example Map Maping would be needed to search for Republic, Magnetism to reach the next era... only Navigation would be as if given for free.

[lockstep]

Another possible bonus of the agricultural trait are larger city size limits, e.g. size 8 without aqueducts and size 14 without hospitals.

SMAC's peacekeeper faction had a bonus of this kind (+2 limit, though SMAC's limits itself were different - 7/14 instead of Civ3's 6/12).

[Louis XXIV]

Originally posted by The Mad Monk
Are we certain that swamp is in there?

Bad news.

The Mesopotamian scenario is listed as having a "Marsh" terrain. They could have easily replaced another terrain type