The Map Room

[E_T]

Part of the Roading will be dependant on the actual Terrain that is in the Interior of the Valley.

As for how we should go about REX'ing (short term), Pamplona & Madrid should be the Settler Centers for the next few Cities. Madrid should be the Spearman build Center for now.

For Sites 2 & 3, at least until it has had some Irrigation to the Plains, it will be limited to size 2. It should have the following for it's first set of builds (* are for things that can change):
1) Warrior
2*) Warrior (should be size 2 at this time, growth limited)
3) Worker (to start the roading & Irrigation)
4) Temple (to start locking in the boarder)
5) Worker
6) Warrior

As for Site 1, even thought it has the Fishes to help with it's growth, it will still require some Irrigation Brought to it for it to thrive. Until we do that, it will be limited to Size 3 (Coast 1 + Fish 2 - 1 Despot = 2 Food). To do that, We will need to Cut the one forrest that is at Madrid #14, then Irrigate & road to the new Site. This site builds should be similar to Site #2, but without the with another Warrior or 2, in place of the Temple (or a Granery), for now. Sometime in there, we plan to have this site build a Wonder, so we will need the growth to bring up the production capability.

Sites 4 to 6 will also be limited in growth, until it had gotten some Irrigation. It's Site 4's builds should be similar to Site 1, whereas #4 & 5 should be similar to #2 & 3.

Is that mid Term enough for now?

[EDIT] Site #3 had Grassland, not plains, so it can get to a higher Pop and can be used for Rexing, too.

Letus Eta Tamali

[Togas]

For consideration, I would like to hear the thought of the people, the notion of moving sites 2 & 3 towards each other.

For protection purposes, I am leaning towards placing Site 2 one space to the east, and placing Site 3 one space to the SW. This would put them both behind rivers, allow us to build roads behind the rivers that would get troops from one city to the next in exactly 1 turn, and give both cities VERY strong surrounding land with which to grow from.

Site 2 would have the following in its 9 tile radius: 8 river tiles, 1 game/forest, 1 grassland, 1 plains, 2 dyes.

Site 3 would have the following in its 9 tile radius: 6 river tiles, 1 game tile (shared), 2 sheilded grasslands, and 2 grasslands (one with horses).

As my computer's graphic program (MS paint) blows, I humbly ask for any volunteers who could better render this proposal and post it.

--Togas

p.s. Is anyone else who's loaded a "during the turn" save of the game noticed the following error? When I load a save that I made whilst in the middle of playing the turn, it applies the production of the cities a 2nd time. When I loaded this past turn's save (which had warrior 1 turn away) the warrior popped up in Pamplona, and Madrid's settlers were one turn closer to being made.

This is an exploitable glitch that, perhaps, should be brought to someone's attention.

[Hot Mustard]

Your proposal for sites 2 and 3 makes alot of sense, Lord Togas. I am sure Señor Tamali can make a beautiful painting that captures your vision.

OOC:
Yes, I have noticed that bug. Each time I have to work with the save again, to do screenshots or such, I replay the turn from the original save, to avoid the bug. Works fine now, since we only have 5 units, but will get very annoying later. I wonder what will happen if Firaxis issues another patch - will everyone upgrade, or stick to 1.14?

[E_T]

Originally posted by Togas
For consideration, I would like to hear the thought of the people, the notion of moving sites 2 & 3 towards each other.

For protection purposes, I am leaning towards placing Site 2 one space to the east, and placing Site 3 one space to the SW. This would put them both behind rivers, allow us to build roads behind the rivers that would get troops from one city to the next in exactly 1 turn, and give both cities VERY strong surrounding land with which to grow from.

Site #3 is South of a River. I'll try to give you a close up of that in a day. But Yes, Site #2 is on the other side of a River. But It has the added benifit of having the city settled right on one of the Silks. THe City would also have the added benifit of also being on the coast, so that we can get full use of the 4 coastal tiles and have it for the building of a Western Fleet, if we so desire.

And, yes both sites are relatively close to Neu Theben, but of the 2 sites, Site 2 has a larger buffer of Jungle, Than Site 3 does. Site 2 has 4 Jungle tiles between it and Neu THeben's Boarder, where Site #3 has only 3.

With A proper Military Road Road Network AND not having a neighbor to our South & West, we are in a better defensive position than any of our Northern Neighbors.

Site 2 would have the following in its 9 tile radius: 8 river tiles, 1 game/forest, 1 grassland, 1 plains, 2 dyes.

Site 3 would have the following in its 9 tile radius: 6 river tiles, 1 game tile (shared), 2 sheilded grasslands, and 2 grasslands (one with horses).

As my computer's graphic program (MS paint) blows, I humbly ask for any volunteers who could better render this proposal and post it.

--Togas

p.s. Is anyone else who's loaded a "during the turn" save of the game noticed the following error? When I load a save that I made whilst in the middle of playing the turn, it applies the production of the cities a 2nd time. When I loaded this past turn's save (which had warrior 1 turn away) the warrior popped up in Pamplona, and Madrid's settlers were one turn closer to being made.

This is an exploitable glitch that, perhaps, should be brought to someone's attention.

If you get it Verified, you might be able to get the bug named after you.

Anyways, let me get some more information for you and we can see waht we'll have.

Letus Eta Lamali.

[E_T]

Sites 2 & 3 - Quick & Dirty Blow ups

[OOC]

THis is a blowup of the 2 sites, with the city boarders. I've drawn the Rivers in to the map, as the Boarders overlay hides some of that detail.



This is the same area, but without the City Boarders. I circled the spots where #2 & #3 would be at.



And again, the same area. This shows the suggested moves by our Lord Togas in Orange, where they currently proposed sites are in blue. Thake note of the number of tiles that will be overlaped, between just those 2 cities, not to mention, the other cities that are to the south of them. This was the really Quick & Dirty part of it...



As you can see, it would have detrimental effect. It's something that we need to fully concider, but I highly recommend my original configuration.

E_T

[edit] something isn't right, they should be pictures and not links

[ReEdit] Fixed it. Lesson, do not use an '&' in an Image Link

[DAVOUT]

The access to ocean is one of the reason why #2 is important, so I favor the initial site on the silk.
#3 could be one tile (or even 2) SW : this would give the 4 tiles jungle buffer, and the overlap with #2, is partly offset by a tile becoming usable and which was not in the initial setting.
As Togas said, cities of military importance should be at 3 tiles of road; this make possible a continuous flow of reinforcements.

[E_T]

Originally posted by DAVOUT
The access to ocean is one of the reason why #2 is important, so I favor the initial site on the silk.
#3 could be one tile (or even 2) SW : this would give the 4 tiles jungle buffer, and the overlap with #2, is partly offset by a tile becoming usable and which was not in the initial setting.
As Togas said, cities of military importance should be at 3 tiles of road; this make possible a continuous flow of reinforcements.

Having the distance between Cities at 3 doesn't make the movement of Mil Units easier, but the proper placements of Military roads does, so that you take full advantage of your movement, between the rivers.

If a 1 move unit starts out at City A, and it has to travel to City B, which would be 2 Turns to get to it (you want to have 1 bit of movement left, so that you can Attack from the city OR Fortify in the City). Now say that there is a River in between the two Cities (like Pamplona & Site #3). You want to try to structure your first Military Road Network, so that the end of you movement on the first turn is just when you cross the River. And After you have built up a large number of Roads, you sometimes have to force the movements of the units, so that they will cross at the point that you want them to, and don't lose any movement.

Sometimes you can't help the placement of either Cities and or the Mil Road Network, but you can try to have it the best that you can.

E_T

[DAVOUT]

Originally posted by E_T


Having the distance between Cities at 3 doesn't make the movement of Mil Units easier, but the proper placements of Military roads does, so that you take full advantage of your movement, between the rivers.

If a 1 move unit starts out at City A, and it has to travel to City B, which would be 2 Turns to get to it (you want to have 1 bit of movement left, so that you can Attack from the city OR Fortify in the City). Now say that there is a River in between the two Cities (like Pamplona & Site #3). You want to try to structure your first Military Road Network, so that the end of you movement on the first turn is just when you cross the River. And After you have built up a large number of Roads, you sometimes have to force the movements of the units, so that they will cross at the point that you want them to, and don't lose any movement.

Sometimes you can't help the placement of either Cities and or the Mil Road Network, but you can try to have it the best that you can.

E_T

The rivers have only a temporary influence.
And I was not referring to the last move of units to the front, but to the whole travel of reinforcments from the producing city to the front. Ideally, a unit produced in turn X in a city five cities away from the front can arrive the same turn on the front when the process is engaged.

But nobody can contest that :*Sometimes you can't help the placement of either Cities and or the Mil Road Network, but you can try to have it the best that you can.
*

[E_T]

One thing that I've done, at least with defensive unit movements, is to do a stagered/shuttle type move. If I want that unit at city 4 and I produse it at city 1, and there are 2 cities between #1 & #4 (call them #'s 2 & 3), I have the first unti move frome 1 to 2, then I have the unit at 2 move to 3, 3 to 4. As for the Offensive Units, we would want to built the slower ones, closer and the faster ones, further away.

As for the River movement Penalty only being temporary, I just have to say that the Anchent Era can take a long time, without the AI to "boost" the tech rate. So our Current long term goals & Plans should take all of this into account.

E_T

[DAVOUT]

Originally posted by E_T
One thing that I've done, at least with defensive unit movements, is to do a stagered/shuttle type move. If I want that unit at city 4 and I produse it at city 1, and there are 2 cities between #1 & #4 (call them #'s 2 & 3), I have the first unti move frome 1 to 2, then I have the unit at 2 move to 3, 3 to 4. As for the Offensive Units, we would want to built the slower ones, closer and the faster ones, further away.


E_T

It is exactly what I had in mind

[E_T]

OOC: Request for Terrain Mods in the Game

I can't tell the difference between a Jungle tile & Forrest tile, with the old Terrain Graphics that come with the game. Could we use a few of the Terrain Mods that snOOpy had done. I can look at what I have and recommend the ones that I have found to look better.

I mostly use the forrest & Jungle Mods, as those are the hardest to distiguish frome each other.

E_T

[Hot Mustard]

Re: OOC: Request for Terrain Mods in the Game

Originally posted by E_T
I can't tell the difference between a Jungle tile & Forrest tile, with the old Terrain Graphics that come with the game. Could we use a few of the Terrain Mods that snOOpy had done. I can look at what I have and recommend the ones that I have found to look better.

I mostly use the forrest & Jungle Mods, as those are the hardest to distiguish frome each other.

E_T

I have never used a mod before, so you'll have to tell me what to do as well as where to get them.

[E_T]

I'll have to dig up the Mods from the Creation Forum. As for installing them, you just replace the original file with the new file. You might want to move the original to a separate folder, before you do this, in case you don't like them.

Personally, I do NOT like the Irrigation Mod, but the New Forrest & Jungles look awsome. THe Rivers have a good mod, easier to see & the Flood Plains, too.

I'll have to make a quick screen shot, of all the terrains, from the editor, when I get the chance.

I can also Zip & attach them to some E-mail and send them to you.

E_T

[OliverFA]

This idea about the mods would be a good one if it makes the rivers, jungle and forest easier to be seen

[astrologix]

Originally posted by E_T

Personally, I do NOT like the Irrigation Mod, but the New Forrest & Jungles look awsome. THe Rivers have a good mod, easier to see & the Flood Plains, too.

E_T

E_T, it sounds good. Please, keep me informed too.