Operation: Glorious Plastic

[Kloreep]

We look like the public forum today. Please, assume good intentions, and don't take things personally.

Back to the game:
I agree with sending troops now. Sure, they won't be enough for action, but it will put less stress on our transport "fleet", (which currently consists of one little galley ) when more Knights start to be built. I'm sure ND/GoW will be okay with them cooling their heels somewhere away from GS' army till we're ready, and it shows some commitment to the alliance. And I doubt GS would attack Legos till we attack them; honor code aside, they won't bring us in to the war if they can help it. So, IMO home defense is actually a pretty small issue up until (and if) we join the war. Vox is rebuilding (and I do mostly trust them), and everyone else is at war and doesn't need another front.

Originally posted by ZargonX
Oh, and I'm against the Seville thing. I know we don't have a "code of honor" but that just feels low. Besides, I don't think RP would give it to us anyway at this point...

Agreed on both points. GS will have doubtless informed RP of our leaning toward GoW-ND; no way RP will trust us now.

[Tiberius]

Well, I didn't take a look at the save , but nevertheless some points:

1. We should send between 12 and 15 knights on Bob. This should be enough to make a decisive hit, if needed.
This is the first priority I think, the knights.

Depending on how things will evolve, we could also send catapults (if requested) and workers.

I'd let for a later debate whether we need a base or not on Bob, in which case we would send a settler and a couple of numibians. The base will be needed only if the war will gain proportions and we will send even more troops who will need to heal quickly and often.

2. The landing spot doesn't really matters, what matters is where to gather our troops. I don't have the map here, so I will suppose that the triangle discussed by Vondrack in the chat is OK for now. This can change quickly anyway, depending on GS troop movements.

3. I say we should start sending whatever we can now. Well, not quite now, but after upgrading our two galleys. With only 3 caravels we won't be able to transport all the troops needed at once, especially if ND would ask some workers or cats, too.

4. I don't think that a GS invasion would be a threat anytime soon. I doubt they have the desire and capability to fight efficiently on 2 fronts. It is obvious that GS will need lots[ of troops to fight both the riders and ansars efficiently. Add to this our knights, so should they want to avoid a defeat on Bob, I doubt they can commit elsewhere. When we should start becoming worried is the moment when GS will start pulling back some of its forces from Bob.
Besides they will need time to prepare such an invasion, time that should be enough for us to prepare some home defences.

[lmtoops]

Before we send any mercs to Bob, we need to decide if the time is right for our GA. I think we would want to hold off on that.

My preference is not to build a settlement on Bob (even temporary) and not to send mercs.

Leo

[vondrack]

Well...

The extra time we took with our 150BC turn really paid off.

ZargonX forgot to start the gunpowder research. Means we will have about ~250g in the bank next turn, but gp will be discovered one turn later. Oh, well...

I have already PMed our allies regarding this and apologized profoundly.

The accountancy:

~250g in bank next turn
-80g for a knight upgrade
-20g for a caravel upgrade
--------
~150g in bank

At ~-95gpt for 5 turns, we should be able to cover up to ~25gpt from our own sources, needing ~70gpt from our allies. That's what I let them know.

[ZargonX]

Yup, definately my bad. Though, on the up side, we do have a little more bank padding I'll talk to our allies about it as well. Though, if a one turn delay in gunpowder is the difference between victory and defeat, I'll eat my hat.

[Sharpe]

Umm, you guys are assuming that we are going to do 100% research. In the chat room we are doubting that our allies will give 350 gold over the next 5 turns, so we are talking about doing anything from 50% to a maximum of 70% research.

[Kloreep]

I would support 100% so long as we can afford it, but I'm also concerned about whether they'll be able to cough up 350 gold in the middle of a war.

[ZargonX]

Yes, those are important considerations we need to find out. If they can't handle the cash, then we can't do the research. They'd better get it figured out on their end before our next turn...

[lmtoops]

We don't need the entire amount; just enough to keep us in the plus side. Technically, we are at war right now and this is part of price. We absorb the cost and let them keep the money to upgrade their spearmen.

[vondrack]

The 350 gold over the next five turns is what our allies expect and already basically agreed to. This (100% gunpowder research partially funded by our allies) was first proposed and discussed almost a month ago, both with them and in our forum (see the Enlightened thread), and generally acknowledged in later chats. I understand it might have already go "out of focus" for us... but not for them, believe me.

Both of our allies are fully aware of these expenses and ready to provide the gold. The 70gpt we'll need means each ally of ours will have to provide us with 35gpt over 5 turns. Both GoW & ND are now in their GA, having the income of 100+ gpt, so 35gpt is not a major deal for them.

Gunpowder is extremely important for all of us - and for them in particular, as GoW & ND will have to defend their stacks/cities against GS knights.

I will get the final confirmation this evening in the regular chat with GoW & ND (18:00 GMT, the chat is usually held either at Apolyton IRC or at Undernet... if you happen to be online, by all means, join us).

[vondrack]

Just a very brief recap of today's chat (I do not think you wanna read the whole log - 95% of it is just Aggie discussing military plans with Darekill):

1) we shall be getting 35gpt+35gpt from this very turn (they sent the gold even before I asked them officially this evening)
2) GS has ~12 knights in the Southern Bob + some support troops
3) both our allies feel they are in good shape
4) they very much rely on our support, though - to the extent of planning or at least seriously considering leaving their eastern coast very lightly defended, throwing all their forces South. Our knights will be very important in their home defenses.

[vondrack]

Hmmm... I guess I should go back to the elementary school... ya know what? I have just discovered 100 extra gold in our coffers (as of the next turn) - because 190+160 is not 250, but 350... oh, well, I don't mind making a mistake like this here and there...

Means we have a nice cash reserve.

[ZargonX]

Means we have a nice cash reserve.

See, isn't that what I told you? I don't make stupid mistakes, I'm just a master planner

[Kloreep]

Originally posted by vondrack
Just a very brief recap of today's chat (I do not think you wanna read the whole log - 95% of it is just Aggie discussing military plans with Darekill):

Would you post the chat? I'd be interested to see their discussion.

[vondrack]

Originally posted by Kloreep
Would you post the chat? I'd be interested to see their discussion.

Attaching the raw chatlog (I do not feel like formatting it as usually - it'd be a waste of time, IMHO... it really is a pretty boring stuff - for us, that is).