Adam Smith's College

[Cort Haus]

This war looks more and more important from the PoV of our wonder-bagging aspirations.

[DeepO]

It does... however we can't be 100% sure. For us, it is important that RP stays out of the war, as they are our wild card: we can e.g. pay them for investigations, or even sabotage of wonders.

But... Lego has the same options in Vox. Even if we're at war with Vox, they can investigate us, and can even steal techs. We would notice it, but can't help it. And we can't declare war to everyone, just to be sure we can't be spied upon...

DeepO

[DeepO]

damn... I knew I had to recount. EotS is able to get to 35 spt before waste (if the city tile gives 2 shields with RR, instead of 3), and will get 2 waste at that stage. Which leads to 33 spt. This is just a bit too low for 12 turns from the GLib to Hoover, but if we have 4 food in the box and an extra mined plain we should be able to make up for the difference by running at 35 spt for 2 turns.

Note that this requires to have 399 shields in the GLib prebuild the turn ToE completes... for every 2 food more in the box, we can miss this mark by 2 shields.

DeepO

[notyoueither]

Originally posted by Cort Haus
GRRR!!!!! Why can't we display pictures anymore?

need to use the image tags. [img.... /img



Edit: Ohhhh, Marrrrkkkk.

[Cort Haus]

[asleepathewheel]

Thanks for that post nye, I've been looking for something like that for PTW.

[DeepO]

erhm... sleepy, that was CH's post of last week which nye tried to correct...

DeepO

[asleepathewheel]

Originally posted by DeepO
erhm... sleepy, that was CH's post of last week which nye tried to correct...

DeepO

I refuse to give CH credit! refuse!

[DeepO]

I'm going to copy the calculations from turn 185 in here:

Originally posted by DeepO
some calculations I need before playing the turn:
at 70%, we currently make 526 bpt, 10 gpt
at 80%, we currently make 601 bpt, -49 gpt.

turn 186 we will discover Steam.

we need 3360 beakers for electricity. 6 turns (currently 3 turns at 80%, 3 turns at 70%, leaving us 177g)
[edit]correction, we will have 245g. Forgot the money we're making now.

turn 192 we discover electricity.

assuming we can trade for medicine before this point, we can start on SM, 2400 beakers.
we are 19 gold short on achieving this in 4 turns at 80%, I'm confident that either by growing or by trade, we can get those 19 gold. 4 turns to SM.
[edit]we don't need the extra money, we will have 49g in the kitty

turn 196, we research SM

Very important note: this assumes we have absolute certainty GoW is going to trade us Medicine before turn 192!
We need to confirm this, it is way too important for us. They have to send it before turn 190 (to have 1 turn leeway), so please ambassadors, work with them and confirm it!

For absolute certainty, we need to build the ToE the turn SM is discovered. So it has to be timed to complete on turn 196, 11 turns from now.

Currently, there are 307 shields in the box, and we're going at 22spt -1fpt. This rate can be held for another 4 turns, at which stage we have to go to 21spt. (or have RRed some tiles, of course).

we need 600 shields for the ToE, so at maximum rate without coal, we can build it in 14 turns (at 21 spt, 22 spt doesn't matter).

With coal, we need to gain 58 shields in the 10 turns between coal and SM. With enough workers ready, we should be able to RR 6 tiles in the first turn of coal, so that we have enough. More workers only means more food in the box.

EotS:
currently we have 120 shields, and are running at 20 spt. in 12 turns, we can be at 320 shields... lower then the GLib. If nobody builds Sistine before turn 194, we can keep having that as a prebuild, meaning we can collect 399 shields by 194, or 32.3 spt for 8 turns. In theory, it can run at 33 spt without food deficit. So, the moment we can, we should start to RR it completely. In fact, it has higher priority then Arashi. Projected completion time of Hoover: turn 207, in 22 turns. (may become 206)

Please RNG, give us coal. And please GoW, for once don't cross us!

DeepO

[DeepO]

and another dp.

[DeepO]

long term economic plans:

turn 192: we get electricity. Assuming we have Medicine by that time, we start on SM

turn 196: we get SM, build the ToE and start on Hoover (should finish in 206)

BTW, Hoover is perfectly timed so far, if all goes well it will have 397 shields in turn 194, meaning that if Lego will switch to Sistine at that time, we can still recuperate without losing our prebuild (it will cost us one pop) If they switch on turn 195 and build in 196, we will have to switch our Sistine prebuild to a ToE prebuild, which will delay our plans by one turn but won't impact eta of Hoover. If they don't build Sistine, Hoover is build in 206.

After ToE, I propose that we rush to Industrialisation. It will be important to us to get our factories up fast. Either GoW can start on this after Med (which will take them some 7-8 turns if they hurry), and we do RP, or they do Sanition and we do Indus. We will burn ~540 gold doing it in 4 turns, or can do it in 4 turns gaining a bit of gold.

So, turn 201, we should have industrialisation (either researched ourselves, or by others).
That's 11 turns from now...

factories are 240 shields, banks are 160, unis 200. Further we have 4 prebuild possibilities: palace (700 shields), Hanging Gardens (300), GLib (400), Oracle (300). Sistine (600) might be open.

As of now (turn 190), we have the following completion times for unis (U), or banks (B) as prebuilds:

Eli : Aqua in 5. U in 21
Inchon : Aqua in 10. U or B not possible, Colloseum in 13
WoC : Iron Works in 28 (will drop to 14 next turn). No prebuild, factory will start after that.
Inchoff : market in 20. No U or B, C in 24.
Diss : uni in 11. Can be delayed by letting D-ville grow. Also possible to change to Harbor(4 turns remaining), and restart uni after that.

Santa Ana : market in 12. U in 26
Blizzard : market in 6. U in 16
Monsoon : Uni in 7. for eta of 11 turns, switch to larger prebuild necessary. making 11 spt currently, so it is worth it.

Arashi : ToE in 7 via Palace (needs one more RR for eta of 6. RR has to be done in less then 2 turns (preferably 2 turns, of course, to not waste a single shield) B in 6 after that.

WW : aqua in 12. U in 32
Tempest : bank in 2. Needs wonder prebuild, U already built.
SS: worker in 2(shows 3)
Hurricane : bank in 12. Will shorten, so either a wonder, or starting the factory later.
OG : uni in 29
EotS : Hoover Dam in 16 (via Sistine). prebuild not possible
BB : uni in 16
Cyclone: worker in 1
Tornado : Uni in 10
Typhoon : Harbor in 8. U in 25
Sufa : market in 17. U in 37.

Looking at this list, wonder prebuilds should go to Hurricane, Monsoon, D-ville and Tempest (after bank). I would switch to Unis whereever possible, with the exception of Elipolis, and possibly Inchon. WW is also possibly better of with an aqua first, but I doubt it.

Our first 2 factories would complete the turn we get Indus (if it comes in 11). That leaves 2 cities without factories in the long run: Cyclone and SS, our 2 worker pumps. That's an extra 54 gpt on upkeep, for an additional ~250 spt in our empire.

DeepO

[DeepO]

screenshot with what I believe are all the positions on which forest has been cut before. Will try to update this as we forest-deforest more tiles for the 10 shield bonus.

In case somebody spots any tiles without a blue dot, which had forest before, please let me know!

[edit: I'm counting 64 tiles which still can receive the forest bonus, or 640 extra shields. Might be a bit off if I missed some tiles, but won't be much]

DeepO

[Cort Haus]

Is the plan to build factories everywhere first (except the pumps) before anything else - once they become available.

[DeepO]

More or less, yes. I'm planning on having factories up asap in all cities, except a few exceptions: WoC as it is better off with the Iron Works, Inchon as it needs food, EotS as it needs to complete Hoover asap.

There are 2 cities which I don't know yet: WW (as it only can make 5 or 7 shields, a factory would be very expensive), and Elipolis, as it might need a harbor first so it can use its plains for mining instead of growth.

DeepO

[DeepO]

More on those factories. It currently is 800 AD, turn 195. we will discover Industrialisation in 860 AD, turn 201 (except if we get a discount on the tech cost as Lego already researched it in the mean time).

We currently have the following eta's for factories in our cities:

Eli : Uni prebuild in 50. Will change with RRing, and possibly needs a harbor beforehand, so not a lot we can say about this.
Inchon : Harbor in 7, factory afterwards... can be done in 40 turns. again not soon enough to be precise.

WoC : Iron Works in 13. Factory 7 turns later. ETA: turn 215 (for 300% shield production, being ~55 spt)

Inchoff : market in 28. if used as prebuild for factory, ETA factory currently at 74 turns. Will be speeded up by RR, but not by much.... perhaps better to not invest the shields in a factory, but go for commerce stuff instead.

Diss : GLib in 17. Factory in 8 (possibly 7). Turn 203
Santa Ana : Uni in 21, Factory in 27. Will be speeded up by RR and growth. So far, Turn 222
Blizzard : Uni in 11. Factory in 15. Will be speeded up by RR and growth. So far, turn 210
Monsoon : Uni in 1. Factory in 22. Will be speeded up by RRing, and getting shields from Arashi. Currently turn 217.

Arashi : ToE in 1 via Palace. Factory in 11. Can be speeded up by RR. Turn 206
WW : Uni in 27. Factory in 35. RR helps. Turn 230
Tempest : Oracle in 10. Factory in 7. Turn 202
SS: worker in 1. No factory
Hurricane : Hanging gardens in 12, Factory in 9 (can go to 8). Turn 203
OG : uni in 17, Factory in 22. Turn 217
EotS : Hoover Dam in 11(via Sistine). Factory in 18. Turn 213.

BB : uni in 8, Factory in 10. Turn 205
Cyclone: worker in 1, no factory
Tornado : Uni in 6, factory in 10 ( can be speeded up by borrowing shields from Sufa). turn 205
Typhoon : Uni in 12, factory in 15. turn 210
Sufa : Uni in 17, factory in 22. turn 217

In many of those cities, we need improvements other then hospitals, especially markets and happiness where needed (sometimes harbors as well). If we're going full out on war, we won't need any unis anymore, and we should be able to switch to mobilisation around turn 220. Very roughly, we're at 30-35 turns from having both marines and tanks, meaning somewhere around turn 225-230. We should be able to get a decent navy, and some defenders before that time.

DeepO