Turn 122, 130 BC

[Arrian]

The 3-way attack on RP is just so much messier. Who gets what?

Nah, I'd prefer the 2 vs. 2. How do we keep it that way? Well, Lego is the only wildcard, and I honestly doubt they can do much about it. How many galleys do you think they have?

I have considered the possibility of a GoW double-cross, but I don't think they will do it. There is much for them to gain from an alliance with us. And I kinda sense they're up for it.

Start of the war: it kinda depends. We told GoW that we would give a 2 turn warning prior to cancellation of a luxury deal, but I'm unclear on what we've told the other teams. I'll have to check the RP diplo thread. If we have to give them 1 turn warning, it sucks, but we gotta do what we said we would do. Hence, GoW declares and attacks ND. We declare on RP, wait 1 turn, and land & attack.

-Arrian

[Arrian]

Speaking of which, where the hell IS the Roleplay Diplo log?

-Arrian

[OPD]

Originally posted by Arrian
Start of the war: it kinda depends. We told GoW that we would give a 2 turn warning prior to cancellation of a luxury deal, but I'm unclear on what we've told the other teams. I'll have to check the RP diplo thread. If we have to give them 1 turn warning, it sucks, but we gotta do what we said we would do. Hence, GoW declares and attacks ND. We declare on RP, wait 1 turn, and land & attack.
-Arrian

With regard to RP we are in a temporary agreement over lux trade while things are discussed further. One turns grace was decided when canceling the current agreement (sorry about that no notice was probably possible) in order to change lux slider. But I may be able to convince them that we are cancelling the temp agreement for reasons other than the fact the war is looming.

Not that I would be in support of a war against RP without further developments.

[OPD]

here

[Arrian]

Ah, thanks for the info, OPD.

I think cancelling the provisional deal would tip RP off that something is up. That gives them more time to prepare than the 1-turn warning, since we're going to need several turns to set this war up, if we decide to do it. EDIT: see next post.

KILL! MAIM! DESTROY! PILLAGE! BURN!

In short, let's do this!

How does "Operation Rogue Wave" sound?

-Arrian

[Arrian]

Hmm, correction: I read your last chat with BigFree.

I think we can drag out the lux deal, continuing to argue that we want the right to cancel the deal at any time. If they don't agree, no deal. Meanwhile, we arrange our forces and prepare to attack.

-Arrian

[OPD]

Originally posted by Arrian
Hmm, correction: I read your last chat with BigFree.

I think we can drag out the lux deal, continuing to argue that we want the right to cancel the deal at any time. If they don't agree, no deal. Meanwhile, we arrange our forces and prepare to attack.

-Arrian

yeah about that. there was one point where I was talking about why no notice should be given and said something along the lines of, if we were to agree a nap with everyone on bob we wouldn't be able to join in a war on their side. Mistake on my part as it may have let RP know that we are considering getting involved millitarily on bob rather than the peaceful building that they otherwise thought we would be doing.

[Aeson]

ETA on Astronomy is 15-20(+1) turns. Copernicus is 400 shields, and we can hold 20 shields per turn in Hurricane for about 10 more turns? It will take us 22-24 turns to build it I think.

If Lego is timing a prebuild, they would beat us even if we were able to finish it on time though. We could fall back and build Smith's or Leo's (600 shields) if we do miss it. Smith's is very important as it is useful and also would trigger Lego's GA peacefully. Magellan's is the only other wonder up to the UN that is Commercial. The swing in being the one with Smith's, instead of one of the one's who don't, could very well mean 400+gpt by the Modern Era. That could mean close to a 25% increase in the size of our supportable army, or in how fast we can research. Smith's is the one we should view as necessary, Copernicus would be nice. Lucky for us, we can time Economics perfectly if we want to.

If we are going to war, it costs us almost 9 Knights though. We have a rather large army at this point, and mostly it's going to be gold that helps us become dominant militarily though. We have well over 1000g in upgrades to do right?

------------------

Has Lego started building the Sistene Chapel yet? If not, they are probably using their Palace as a prebuild for it, meaning they couldn't have a (well timed) prebuild in place for Copernicus.

[Arrian]

What do you think about the proposed military action, Aeson (see: Calling all StormHawks!)?

-Arrian

[Aeson]

I think it would be best to leave GoW out of it somehow actually. Long term NAP's with ND and GoW (that we let them talk us into), then a 'blessing' (as in, we wouldn't join in such a war against GoW) to GoW on the GoW+RP vs ND option, and then act on our own against RP. The end result is pretty much the same (other than not making an enemy of ND). We also end up not having any strings attached to help GoW in case ND ends up beating them or at least holding them off.

Problems with these types of plans is if they end up public, and they probably almost always will end up public at least in the "hey, you didn't hear it from me" sense. RP knowing we have long term NAP's with ND and GoW isn't as bad as RP and ND finding out we have an alliance with GoW against them. If GoW were backstabbing us, it would end up GS vs Bob. No, let's not put our fate in the hands of GoW.

Riders are good, but remember that they are only 3 move units, attacking against 3 and 6 move units (on roads) while on the offensive. If ND is using a similar amount of shields in Pikes, Cats, and Med Inf, they will beat down a purely Rider army unless they are caught with their pants down. If GoW is using Cats, Pikes, and Med Inf to support their Riders, it reduces the individual power of Riders to not much more than ND's Med Inf since they can move 3 tiles on their roads. They end up pretty much on even terms with ND overall, and I wouldn't be suprised if it results in a stalemate. Even if ND won't have Chivalry till later in the war.

[notyoueither]

Originally posted by Aeson
I think it would be best to leave GoW out of it somehow actually. Long term NAP's with ND and GoW (that we let them talk us into), then a 'blessing' (as in, we wouldn't join in such a war against GoW) to GoW on the GoW+RP vs ND option, and then act on our own against RP. The end result is pretty much the same (other than not making an enemy of ND). We also end up not having any strings attached to help GoW in case ND ends up beating them or at least holding them off.

That is most likely the best solution I have heard. Not only that, but we would likely have Lego pledging support to us to get us to aid ND.