Emperors at 20 Paces

[Aqualung71]

Originally posted by Modo44
Though courage is not one of your virtues, methiks.

I take that charge as a grave insult, Emperor. Please withdraw it

[Modo44]

Originally posted by Aqualung71
I take that charge as a grave insult, Emperor. Please withdraw it

Why? Does it hurt when someone stands up and tells the truth into your face, Senator? Tell me, what did you military operations bring to our empire? The sacking of a small barbarian camp? The withdrawal from Celtic lands? Not very impressive.

[Paddy]

I actually thought that ths thread was for the discussion of Strategy

please take this discussion to the Senate Floor, or a new thread

Thank you Senators

[Aqualung71]

Senator Paddy, honourable PPP, your esteem transcends comparison in the civilised world. Yet I must protest. Emperor Modo has accused me of cowardice....me, the Emperor Elect of our Roman Senate. I reserve the right to respond, as you would in my position!

[Paddy]

and so you shall old chap

just in an appropriate place

[Aqualung71]

Emperor Modo:

The successful running of an empire requires finesse and diplomacy, not merely the ability to act on impulse and bravado and wield a sword against one's weaker neighbours.

I am disappointed and angered at your charge of cowardice. My rationale for making peace with the Celts was explained in detail, yet you have chosen to ignore my logic and suggest that foolhardy military bravery is more desirable. When hot-headed desires for military glory are acted upon impulsively, such as you have in your reign, the entire future of empire is put in jeopardy.

I once respected your reign as Emperor, yet I now see clearly that you only sought acclamation and exaltation from the Senate. The long-term benefit of Rome shall be served very well by the actions undertaken during the reign of the Emperor Aquavian Lungarius. I daresay time shall not judge your leadership so well, as you needlessly and selfishly promoted your own self-interest above the good of the people, and the hearts of the mothers of Rome who sent their lads out to battle ill-prepared and under-strength.

Thankfully this self-indulgent bahaviour has been brought to a halt. The economy or Rome has been elevated to a greater level, and future Emperors shall have the services of hordes of Workers to even further improve the economy.

I am quite prepared to rest on my record. I will be judged by the people of Rome.....and not by a meglomaniac Emperor, jealous of his power being usurped! My record in the economic measures available to us is as follows, over the 25 years of my reign:

GNP: +21%
Manufactured Goods: +48%
Productivity: +24%

With statistics such as these in a short 25 years, Rome has advanced substantially. If these improvements can be maintained, there is no doubt Rome shall continue to be all powerful. Under such economic prosperity with such substantial production power, Emperor Modo's winge about Celtic Swordsmen is exposed as mere slander. The Celts will never have the productive power to send more than a handful of Gallic Swordsmen against Rome. And remember, the Gallic Swordsman at 3 attack is vastly inferior to even our Legionary II.

At the time of my reign, we were ill-prepared to conduct military operations against the Celts, and our military strength was needed south against Carthage. Emperor Modo's reckless abandon and glory-seeking has been checked for the good of Rome.

Again, I stand on my record. I sought no accolades, and conducted no reckless acts of military bravado. I acted for the long-term benefit of the glorious Roman Empire!

[Snowflake]

Very convincing.

/me nods her head.

[Aqualung71]

Originally posted by Snowflake
Very convincing.

* Snowflake nods her head.

Thank you Senator. Your support is noted and appreciated

[Beta]

Senator Optimus Betarius also nods in agreement.

(Then again - with Betarius it is never clear if he isn't just nodding off...)

[Addled Platypus]

Too interesting of a dilema

Yes, what should happen to an Emperor who does not do the will of the senate, even if all intentions and outcomes still benefit Rome.

The plans were disscussed, votes were made. Direction of the Empire was set in motion.

I cannot give my support to the actions taken by Emperor Aqualung. This kind of action must to allowed to continue by any other Emperor.

I ask that if there needs to be a change in direction that is needed. Let us debate and vote. I would then be proud to give my support.

Thank you Senators

[McMeadows]

I have high esteem of our emperor and he has earned his merits, still the bravest action during his reign was to ignore the senate's wishes. Allthough well argumented and maybe even a wise decission, this upsets me as a senator. Is our voice not heard? Are we just mere puppets to the emperor? Senator Modo often seems to be a bit too compulsive in his actions and words, but nonetheless we should respect the freedom of speech.

[Paddy]

Senator Platypus Rex you do raise the issue of whether Emperor Aquavian Lungarius actually followed the will of the Senate

Originally posted by Platypus Rex
Too interesting of a dilema

Yes, what should happen to an Emperor who does not do the will of the senate, even if all intentions and outcomes still benefit Rome.

The plans were disscussed, votes were made. Direction of the Empire was set in motion.

I cannot give my support to the actions taken by Emperor Aqualung. This kind of action must to allowed to continue by any other Emperor.

I ask that if there needs to be a change in direction that is needed. Let us debate and vote. I would then be proud to give my support.

Thank you Senators

At this time the The Grand Book of Rome - Our Law states:

Originally posted by Paddy the Scot

This is all open to negotiation and change in the mighty Senate of Rome.

-----------------------------------


1. The land is led by an Emperor and the Senate of Rome

2. Each Senator has a vote

3.a. The Emperor is successively rolled through a list of players that are on The Great Roll of Emperors
3.b. Please feel free to add your name to the list.
3.c. You may nominate someone else, but they will not be added to the list until they agree.
3.d. A Senator nominated by another player will not be accepted until they personally accept.
3.e. The nominated player needs to be a member of the Civ 3 Demo Game Civ Group.
3.f. Names may be added to the list at any time.
3.g. If a name is added to the list after it has been rolled over, they will need to await until their Family name is called according to the list.

4.a. The Consuls are drawn from the The Great Roll of Emperors. Here we take the Emperor who has just Retired, and the next Two Heirs to the Throne.

It is the Consul’s job to present and moderate ideas for the Emperor to utilize during his term. This means through running threads, polls and getting discussions underway and followed through.

5. All Senators to be registered in the The Roll of Senators


-----------------------------------


The order of play:

The Initial Save is posted

The Senate gathers and discusses the situation in threads and polls

The Emperor starts a multi-vote poll to give the Senate a last opportunity for guidance before starting his turns

The Emperor then goes on and plays a series of 5 turns

The Emperor then comes back and:
- start a thread for their reign and in here write up a report (this can be done with assistance of other Senators
- the save is posted in the Sacred Save thread for everyone to look over
- pictures, maps etc are posted in their Reign thread

These turn sessions can be interrupted by emergencies that need to be sort by the Consuls and / or the Senate. Thus some sessions would only be the turns until the emergency is declared. Then the Emperor continues until his 5 turn are completed.



The final save is posted

This ends the Emperor’s reign

We then move the reign to the next Senate Family that is listed on The Great Roll.

If that Great Family is not able to take up the Empire, then the Consul’s will invite the next Family on the list to step forward.

Once all names on the list have been exhausted, we start at the top of the list.

-----------------------------------

All Senators of Rome have an Equal vote

Yet it is the Emperors right to lead

He has Consuls to assist, and the right to stop his session to consult with either the Consuls and / or the Senate

Do you see a problem here?

[Paddy]

Originally posted by McMeadows
I have high esteem of our emperor and he has earned his merits, still the bravest action during his reign was to ignore the senate's wishes. Allthough well argumented and maybe even a wise decission, this upsets me as a senator. Is our voice not heard? Are we just mere puppets to the emperor? Senator Modo often seems to be a bit too compulsive in his actions and words, but nonetheless we should respect the freedom of speech.

ahh yes indeed, more questions on Emperor Aquavian Lungarius actions, which is a very important discussion

Yet the Emperor's initial post is a request to have a grave insult retracted

Originally posted by Aqualung71

Originally posted by Modo44

Though courage is not one of your virtues, methiks.

I take that charge as a grave insult, Emperor. Please withdraw it

I do believe this matter needs to be addressed

Should this be allowed

It is noted that we all come from different people groups from a number of nations throughout the known world

It is also noted that we are utilizing a common language in our dealings with each other, and that this may not be our mother tongue

Also that that in these lands, certain words can have different meanings / attitudes / contexts

It is not the intent on forming this Senate to have people personally insulted

[Modo44]

Paddy, please don't get upset about this. Both me and Aqualung are roleplaying a bit here. No hard feelings, really.

Originally posted by Aqualung71
The successful running of an empire requires finesse and diplomacy, not merely the ability to act on impulse and bravado and wield a sword against one's weaker neighbours.

Finesse and diplomacy are important virtues, I agree. But halting an ongoing invasion, which could be reinforced without any problems, seems a little too cautious to me. Dangerously cautious.

Originally posted by Aqualung71
I am disappointed and angered at your charge of cowardice. My rationale for making peace with the Celts was explained in detail, yet you have chosen to ignore my logic and suggest that foolhardy military bravery is more desirable. When hot-headed desires for military glory are acted upon impulsively, such as you have in your reign, the entire future of empire is put in jeopardy.

Let's stick to the facts here. You deliberately acted against the Senate's decision. Also, you made it possible for the Celts to keep growing, which endangers our future expansion. While I understand your logic, I must dismiss it as too passive against the barbarians.

Originally posted by Aqualung71
I once respected your reign as Emperor, yet I now see clearly that you only sought acclamation and exaltation from the Senate. The long-term benefit of Rome shall be served very well by the actions undertaken during the reign of the Emperor Aquavian Lungarius.

Oh, you mean the long term benefit of making the Senate unimportant in directing the Empire? Or do you mean the long term benefit of having to face hordes of Gallic Swordsmen?

Originally posted by Aqualung71
I daresay time shall not judge your leadership so well, as you needlessly and selfishly promoted your own self-interest above the good of the people, and the hearts of the mothers of Rome who sent their lads out to battle ill-prepared and under-strength.

I need not defend my decisions. They were made by the Senate and they were executed both with swiftness and great effect. Senators have noted the good shape in which I left the Empire for future generations.

Originally posted by Aqualung71
I am quite prepared to rest on my record. I will be judged by the people of Rome.....and not by a meglomaniac Emperor, jealous of his power being usurped! My record in the economic measures available to us is as follows, over the 25 years of my reign:

GNP: +21%
Manufactured Goods: +48%
Productivity: +24%

Great job indeed. It should be noted, however, that the empire was already growing in almost every aspect, when you picked it up - after my ruling period. I bow to your abilities to continue good strategies that have already been started.

Originally posted by Aqualung71
With statistics such as these in a short 25 years, Rome has advanced substantially. If these improvements can be maintained, there is no doubt Rome shall continue to be all powerful. Under such economic prosperity with such substantial production power, Emperor Modo's winge about Celtic Swordsmen is exposed as mere slander. The Celts will never have the productive power to send more than a handful of Gallic Swordsmen against Rome. And remember, the Gallic Swordsman at 3 attack is vastly inferior to even our Legionary II.

Perhaps he is, perhaps he isn't. The idea, however, was to never have to find out. You broke it.

Originally posted by Aqualung71
At the time of my reign, we were ill-prepared to conduct military operations against the Celts, and our military strength was needed south against Carthage. Emperor Modo's reckless abandon and glory-seeking has been checked for the good of Rome.

Yes, I was truly hard on the barbarians. I sought to destroy them and had success. I did so in accordance with the Senate's decisions. What a "reckless abandon" of possibilities, what a "glory-seeking" act.


My opinion, concerning the peace treaty with the Celts, is as follows. The Emperor should have at least addressed the Senate to ask if it would be for the good of the Empire. A simple Yea/Nay vote would make the matter clear enough.

[ChrisiusMaximus]

My input here is that I commend the improvements in the finances of Rome, but the question of peace should have been put to the senate without doubt!!!

We will all doubtless have differing views on different issues, for example I feel workers are less important than legionaries and the more legionaries we build the more slaves we will capture from our enemies!!!

Each Emporer must have the autonomy to carry out the routine mundane stuff of every turn but a decision as important as a peace treaty should and must be put before the senate for proper debate !!!

On that Senator Aquavian Lungarius is out of order!!! and it is now only right that this issue be addressed by the whole senate.

I dont however feel there is need for harsh punishment as this can be put down to inexperience and lets face it on the whole the second Emporers reign has done well for Rome!!!

Senator Modo I understand your view point, I agree with your view point, but I do feel it was unfair to question the senators courage. Perhaps we need to be reminded that Aquavian Lungarius did complete the cleansing of Sicily, which in itself is a splendid military achievement and Rome owes it thanks to the senator. I believe that Senator Modo should publicly apologise to Senator Aquavian Lungarius at a full meeting of the whole Senate!!!

I would suggest that we all learn from this debacle that no man is an island and that the People and the Senate of Rome demand obedience from their elected Emporers.