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War Academy: Attack the tech leaders

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  • War Academy: Attack the tech leaders

    Yes, that's right - attack the tech leaders.
    We have high hopes for being the leaders in tech, but unfortunately, it looks as though these hopes will not become a reality until late in the industrial age.
    In addition to building additional libraries, universities, marketplaces and banks thus improving our research capabilities we must also damage those of others in order to achieve our goals!!
    Our possibilities are many. To put it straight, we need to attack Greece, Germany, England and Rome by any order and minimize their ability to research on their own (but not necessarily annex them, especially in Rome's case).
    We can attack Greece, Germany or England (preferably England first, since they're the weakest, it seems) by land using our cavalries and blitz through their territory, taking a lot of river land and reducing their research capabilities by 30% to 40% in just 5 turns.
    We can attack Rome by sea (or by land if we sign a RoP with Russia, but that's somewhat risky) and shave off the part of their territory that is adjacent to the Iroquois or Babylonian territory and then gift it to the Iroquois or the Babylonians. That territory will not do much good in our hands due to corruption and waste, but the Iroquois and Babylonians will be able to make good use of it, including holding off the foul Romans.

    Discuss!
    "Close your eyes, for your eyes will only tell the truth,
    And the truth isn't what you want to see,
    Close your eyes, and let music set you free..."
    - Phantom of the Opera

  • #2
    Yes, we must slow them down to speed us up! I wouldn't be TOO awful concerned with Rome, though. We take out a chunk of Germany and Greece, we should be able to out research them. Focus on what is close, there is no point in attacking Rome right now. Slow England, Slow Greece, Destroy (or nearly) Germany, IMO.
    One who has a surplus of the unorthodox shall attain surpassing victories. - Sun Pin
    You're wierd. - Krill

    An UnOrthOdOx Hobby

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    • #3
      Originally posted by UnOrthOdOx
      Yes, we must slow them down to speed us up!
      I believe you said this once before when you stated that what's important is not our absolute rate of scientific progress but our relative rate of scientific progress.
      "Close your eyes, for your eyes will only tell the truth,
      And the truth isn't what you want to see,
      Close your eyes, and let music set you free..."
      - Phantom of the Opera

      Comment


      • #4
        That's right, It doesn't matter if we can only research a new tech every 10 turns if it takes the AI 12 turns to do it. We still beat them to it, and can whore it out.

        Waging war on them also provides us an opportunity to effect their current research by inflicting Weariness (if we choose to prolong the war, think what an alliance with the Aztecs(and whomever else we wish) against Germany and/or Greece could accomplish), slow their wonder building, or make them divert funds to the war effort. Weariness for us is less of a problem as we are religious, and can get out of it if we need.
        One who has a surplus of the unorthodox shall attain surpassing victories. - Sun Pin
        You're wierd. - Krill

        An UnOrthOdOx Hobby

        Comment


        • #5
          As part of this discussion, we need to look at what our objectives would be, i,e, what do we want? Here are the "Big 4".

          Germany - 1 Science Wonder that is within spitting distance of our border (Berlin). They appear to be the main leaders in Tech, by the fact that they are getting money from the other Civ's. If they get to Motarized transport before we do, we could look at a possible Panzer Blitz against us after that. If thay are reduce, they could become a client state and any Panzers won't be a problem, because we would be able to out produce them with regular tanks. They are currently building NU, but not in a city that could beat the others. Thaking Berlin, Stutgart, Hamburg, Cologne, Hannover & Frankfort would completely eliminate whatever tech lead that they could have and still leave them with enough (5 cities) to pay us for our techs. If we needed to, we could Raze Nurumburg & Frankfurt, to remeove thier cultureal pressure. Germany, or someone else could rebuild on those sites. We could also raze those cities at sometime in the future, to spank the Germans, if they did want to get frisky with Panzers against us.

          England - They have been lagging in 2nd or third place behind Germany, although they have come up from 4th place to this position, due to a large exploration fleet for maps. They have NV in Nottingham, which will be on the list. At quick glance, London looks to be in the lead to building NU. If we want that Science Wonder, we will have to take it from someone else, and I say it will be a really valid reason TOBE at war with them . We might want to wait until they are finished with it before taking it from them (I'll try to have an estimate of when they will complete NU within the week). We should look to taking London, Oxford, Warwick, York, Hastings, Nottingham, Coventry & Norwich. This would leave them with 5 cities, too. Liz would be no threat to us again and could become Aggie's maid.

          Rome - THey are only in second place by the fact that they have been able to pay Germany every time they get a new tech. Take out Germanies tech lead, you hinder Rome's money making machine,which would have to switch to Science to compensate. But, if we becore the tech leader, it shows that they are willing to pay to be at the top. We are slated to take just a couple of their cities and they are too far away at this current time to be of any use to us. We might get some cities and possible a bit of cash and tech, but not really likely. We should look to Roman land after the Palace has been moved. They have JSB, which would help us out with happiness, but we'll only need it in the later game.

          Greece - They currently are the "runt" of the Big 4. They have been laging behind the others by as little as 3 turns and as much as 5. We have actually been ahead of them for a breif period. They are apparently building up there cash and letting the price drop a bit before getting the techs from someone else, most likely from either Rome or England. So, again taking down the top leader would require them on relying more in thier or research or on the other two. Yes, a number of thier cities a messing up our cultural funch-way (?SP), but are keeping thier culture at bay with ours. This is another Civ that we should go after, after the Palace has been moved, otherwise, any new cities would be mostly corrupt and draining (i.e. rushes) on our economy to bring up to snuff. If they do get involved in an alliance or MPP against us, we could spank them back a bit an take some of the cities that are in our area. Only a few of these before the Palace move would not be that detrimental, but should only be an option only if were attacked by them.

          Which ever we decide to have at, we need to keep in mind that ATLEAST ONE of the other big 4 and maybe the Aztecs might get involed against us, so we need to have proper defensive and reserve offensive forces available to fight them off. THese aren't France or America that we are talking about, so be warned.

          E_T
          Come and see me at WePlayCiv
          Worship the Comic here!
          Term IV DFM for Trade, Term V CP & Term VI DM, Term VII SMC of Apolytonia - SPDGI, Minister of the Interior of the PTW InterSite Demo Game

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          • #6
            Yes! We must attack! Greece, Germany, England, it doesn't matter in a big picture strategic sense. Each has the techs we crave. However, short term tactics will help us choose our next bloodmeal.

            We simply must take atleast 2 of the 4 AI engines off of the current tech.

            Khufu awaits instruction. Let him complete his holy quest.

            I hereby formally begin the process of seeking membership in the War Academy.

            roadcage
            I used to be a builder. That was before I played Civ III

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            • #7
              E_T has convinced me that our next target should be Germany because Germany is the tech leader and because we want to nail them before they get Panzers.
              As soon as the SMC (this or next term) approves we must prepare for a cavalry blitz against Germany and take Berlin, Stutgart, Hamburg, Cologne, Hannover and Frankfort, as E_T said. This should be top priority!
              "Close your eyes, for your eyes will only tell the truth,
              And the truth isn't what you want to see,
              Close your eyes, and let music set you free..."
              - Phantom of the Opera

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              • #8
                Again, we must consider allies. Rest assured that Germany WILL pull someone else in, they have plenty of resources to do so. Perhaps it would be in our best interest to ally up first, as soon as we declare war. Even if it only proves a minor distraction, it will be to our advantage. I would suggest the Aztecs and/or Greece as allies, but leave out England in hopes of Germany pulling them in against us so that we can have their wonders as well.

                Any other allies Germany can get do not matter much other than trading, as they will be forced to come through the narrow pass we now hold, or via boat, and we all know how adept the AI is at using naval assaults...

                And besides all the talk of Science, I, PERSONALLY, will never forget that Bismark attempted to stab ME in the back when I made the first assault on Paris...Let Bismark lay cowering in a corner with his friend Xerxes for the dishonorable actions he has taken against Apolytonia!!!
                Last edited by UnOrthOdOx; November 11, 2002, 13:56.
                One who has a surplus of the unorthodox shall attain surpassing victories. - Sun Pin
                You're wierd. - Krill

                An UnOrthOdOx Hobby

                Comment


                • #9
                  I dunno about an alliance. You have to commit to 20 turns in an alliance and we're more into 5-7 turns blitzes. Given the imminent switch to Democracy, it will be even more important that we limit the war to a short period.
                  "Close your eyes, for your eyes will only tell the truth,
                  And the truth isn't what you want to see,
                  Close your eyes, and let music set you free..."
                  - Phantom of the Opera

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                  • #10
                    The automatic declaration part of Aliances last 20 turns. Once the war begins, you need to delay peace until your partner in crime has settled. And in any event, it is just a rep hit. Our rep is so bad already it really doesn't matter.
                    I used to be a builder. That was before I played Civ III

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                    • #11
                      If Germany is the tech leader, it stands to reason that it is the one who is proliferating knowledge all over the place, giving techs away to its AI buddies while keeping us in the dark ages.

                      We must over-prepare for an attack though. It isn't enough to assume that the AI will sue for peace in 5-7 turns. Afterall, we aren't talking about attacking a wounded duck; Germany has the potential to draw in allies against us.

                      I don't know if we can go this road alone. I think eventually we will have to make tough decisions about the possibility of allying ourselves with others. We have an extremely unmanagable northern border to defend if, say, Germany was able to persuade Greece and England to attack us. We would immediately have spread ourselves too thin and spend the remainder of the war in defense of the homeland and looking for a way out.

                      The age of the MPP and trade embargoes is coming quickly. If we want to prune a neighbor back to give us a boost, it had better be soon as the likelihood of financial loss and costly protracted war is only growing.
                      "The dogmas of the quiet past are inadequate to the stormy present. The occasion is piled high with difficulty, and we must rise with the occasion. As our case is new, so we must think anew and act anew. We must disenthrall ourselves, and then we shall save our country." -- Abraham Lincoln

                      "Generations to come will scarce believe that such a one as this ever, in flesh and blood, walked upon this earth." -- Albert Einstein, in regards to Mohandis Gandhi

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                      • #12
                        On the contrary - our rep is flawless. We've never broken a treaty in our entire game history. The AIs hate us only because we're so damn big and powerful, and maaaaybe because we eliminated a civ or two...
                        In any case, the importance of our reputation is not to be disregarded. Just break one treaty and see if anyone wants to ally with us again in the next 100 turns.
                        "Close your eyes, for your eyes will only tell the truth,
                        And the truth isn't what you want to see,
                        Close your eyes, and let music set you free..."
                        - Phantom of the Opera

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Democracy is for peace, simply don't switch till this is over. It is perfectly feasable to carry out a 20 turn offensive war while maintaining a Republic with a few sacrifices (my personal record was 68 turns of OFFENSIVE war in Republic until the government collapsed even though I had NO cities in disorder at the time...(Monarch Difficulty)), but I would suggest a preemptive switch to Monarchy. Even if we Blitz Germany and sue in 5-7 turns, we will be contending with the aftermath of that, ie, however many allies Germany has brought in. Germany has enough techs to buy the lesser developed nations, and enough cash to pursuade the advanced nations (not that they need a whole lot of pursuasion). It would be better to bring a few on our side first.
                          One who has a surplus of the unorthodox shall attain surpassing victories. - Sun Pin
                          You're wierd. - Krill

                          An UnOrthOdOx Hobby

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            With 7 luxuries, marketplaces in all our large cities, cathedrals and The Sistine Chapel I think we can continue the war while holding off war weariness for longer than enough to make Bismarck beg for mercy.
                            "Close your eyes, for your eyes will only tell the truth,
                            And the truth isn't what you want to see,
                            Close your eyes, and let music set you free..."
                            - Phantom of the Opera

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                            • #15
                              3 of those luxes are trades. When do they expire?
                              I used to be a builder. That was before I played Civ III

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