Extra cash through selling techs

[Shiber]

Since we're in dire need for extra cash to fund military purchases and upgrades along with civil projects, I have come up with this plan, which is basically to sell off our techs in exchange for a few coins and some other commodities.
The revenues from each deal are pathetic, but the total revenues are equal to a turn's income so it might be a good idea to consider this plan, or at least parts of it.

* America
Sell: Monotheism.
Revenue: 16 lytons, 1 worker and their world map.
Comments: I don't see anything wrong with this deal. The Americans having Monotheism will not harm us in any way, and that extra worker could be handy as well. We should definitely do this one.

* Iroquois
Sell: Chivalry.
Revenue: 6 lytons and their world map.
Comments: The Iroquois don't have iron nor horses. If you look at the map you'll also notice that they're effectively sealed off by the Romans and therefore will not be able to settle in a spot that has access to either resources. Considering their lacking road system and the fact that they have no harbor, nor will they build one in the near future, we can safely assume that they won't get the necessary resources for building knights before they're old news. Since they cannot build knights, and Chivalry is a dead-end tech, we're basically giving them NOTHING for something. Such deals are always good deals IMHO.

* Babylon
Sell: Chivalry.
Revenue: 9 lytons and their world map.
Comments: Same deal with the Iroquois, they are completely blocked off from all sources of iron and horses. "Nothing for something" deals are my bag baby, yeah!

* France
Sell: Chivalry.
Revenue: 10 lytons and their world map.
Comments: I do not view France as a military threat. They have been pushed away from most of their fertile and productive grasslands and mountains and into plains and deserts. Furthermore, they depend on us for their supply of horses. Therefore France having Chivalry will not make them a threat to us and we can do this trade safely.

* Sum-up
Total earnings: 41 lytons, an American worker and world maps.
Extra benefits: Improved relations with all the above-mentioned civs (AIs always improve their attitude towards you when you offer them good deals). None of those civs likes us but after we execute these trades the situation will likely change in our favor.

As always, comments and suggestions will be appreciated.

[joncnunn]

American trade proposal:
We need more slaves for Clearing Jungle, so it sounds like a good deal to me to get 16 gold from them instead of the Aztecs getting a share every turn chat by razing one of their cities. (Worker is probably valued at 20 to 25 gold.)

Irq trade proposal : Nyet. What if they get manage to acquire iron and horses? Plus lowers the value we might get from selling it to somewhat with somewhat more cash.

bab trade proposal. Nyet. Same reason.

France? After that last war? No way in h---.

[Togas]

Re: Extra cash through selling techs

Originally posted by Shiber
The revenues from each deal are pathetic, but the total revenues are equal to a turn's income so it might be a good idea to consider this plan, or at least parts of it.

We need 80L to upgrade a single knight.

I'm considering the proposal, though. I'd like to hear more discussion. My current thoughts are:

America -- We have plans to sell them this tech, but I was reserving the sale of it. I may reconsider. We want to sell America a "useless" tech right before we declare war on them (at some nebulous point in the future) so that they are unable to rush defenders or buy allies. Our goal is to deprive them of their cash just before attack. We need to keep some non-military tech around to sell them for this purpose.

However, it's always good to get an extra American Industrious worker.

Iriquois -- The Foreign Ministry has selected them for "Charity" status, and I don't mind grossly uneven trades with them on that account. Chivalry would give them Longbowmen, and if they ever get in a fight with Rome, it could help.

Frankly, the 6L we'd get is virtually worthless, so I'm almost in favor of just giving the tech away.

Babylon and France -- If either of these guys could pony up a decent cash payment for this tech, I'd sell it to them, but my conscience just pains me to see them get a useful military unit (France would even get knights) for such a pitiful sum. Babylon isn't a real danger, and may soon qualify for "Charity" status, but France is FURIOUS with us. Sure, we sell them wines, dyes, and horses. I think their diplomatic hands are tied. They can't possibly declare war, but if another civ offers them $$ to join in a war with us, they'd take it. Their irrational AI hatred is pretty high. We need to hope that, in time, it calms down.

Anyhow, those are my immediate thoughts. I'll read this thread tonight/tomorrow and decide what ought to be sold before the next turnchat.

--Togas

[Aggie]

Edit to clarify sorry, i messed up the initial post. We do the american deal. with the worker that is worth almost 40g. Now we then gift the worker to any civ we are going to trade chivilary to, since we will get it back free with the trade, there thats better. Example if party "A" has 10 gold we gift the worker to them, then offer to sell give them chiv for gold+ new worker. We get people liking us and we get alittle gold, though to be honest hardly enough, except for american case I'd say no.
Aggie

[Shiber]

Originally posted by joncnunn
Irq trade proposal : Nyet. What if they get manage to acquire iron and horses? Plus lowers the value we might get from selling it to somewhat with somewhat more cash.

bab trade proposal. Nyet. Same reason.

You're kidding right? The Iroquois are a threat?
Both the Iroquois and the Babylonians will be eliminated by Rome or Russia before we ever manage to exchange fire with these minor players.

Originally posted by joncnunn
France? After that last war? No way in h---.

We kicked their asses, joncnunn. We wiped the floor with them. We burned their horrid 'designer clothes' and spilled their stinking perfumes into the ocean.
France is not a threat. Period. We've handled France before with much success, and now they're barely half as strong as they were before and we're nearly twice as strong as we were then, and the gap just keeps getting bigger.
Furthermore, France is the least aggressive nation in the game. Their aggression setting is 1 out of 5 (the bare minimum).
Finally, France will get Chivalry anyway in a matter of 5 to 10 turns, you can count on that.

[Shiber]

Originally posted by Togas
We want to sell America a "useless" tech right before we declare war on them (at some nebulous point in the future) so that they are unable to rush defenders or buy allies.

Theology can do the job.

Originally posted by Togas
France is FURIOUS with us. Sure, we sell them wines, dyes, and horses. I think their diplomatic hands are tied. They can't possibly declare war, but if another civ offers them $$ to join in a war with us, they'd take it. Their irrational AI hatred is pretty high. We need to hope that, in time, it calms down.

France's AI aggression setting is 1 out of 5 (the bare minimum). With all those trade agreements, their dependancy on us for a supply of horses and the fact that we're so strong and they're the second weakest nation (after America of course), it's next to impossible that they'll declare war on us anywhere in the next 30 turns.

By the way, I forgot to note that since all these trades are fairly crummy and we're selling techs for much less than they're worth, the AIs we'll trade our techs to will like us much better as a result.

[Shiber]

Originally posted by Aggie
We could buy the american worker for hard cash and turn around an sell them the tech, since the have more cash we probably could get it all.
Aggie

They're already offering all the money they've got.

[Shiber]

Originally posted by Aggie
We could buy the american worker for hard cash and turn around an sell them the tech, since the have more cash we probably could get it all.
Aggie

They're already offering us all the money they've got. We can't squeeze anything more out of them.

[Ninot]

i think someone has made this complaint before.....

don't use lytons outside of RP? yeah....

doesnt bother me of course

the deals arent that great.... but its better WE be making the profits now rather than another civ making them later

and besides, the profits will lessen as they get closer to these techs. so no time better than the present to sell sell sell

[Sheik]

Is 41 gold all we can get?

[GodKing]

I say wait a few turns (although buy the american worker if we can). Then see if we get more. We need money, but not chairity, yet.

[BigFurryMonster]

Actually, it would have been better if the Iroquois had any Iron+Horses, so they would become more of a threat to Rome. They are just too small and far off to be a threat to us.

The only danger I see in this: they might trade Chivalry away to some other Civ. Are there any 'big' Civs who do not have Chivalry yet?

Does an American slave actually work twice as fast as other slaves because of the Industriousness?

Caution with the French: they might be small, but so are mosquitos...

[Shiber]

I'll relate to some points raised in this thread:

Q: Is 41 gold all we can get?
A: Yes. But as they say, beggers can't be choosers. We're in dire need for cash to complete military upgrades!

Q: Shouldn't we wait a few more turns?
A: And allow those civs to complete research themselves and lose the trade option altogether? No, I say do it now.

Q: Are there any major players who don't have Chivalry or Monotheism (the techs we're trading off) yet?
A: No.

Q: Do the French pose a threat?
A: Not any more than the Americans do.
The French are peaceful (AI aggression level of 1 out of 5) so they don't build many military units. They depend on us for their supply of horses, dyes and wines. They've lost over half of their production capability, while we doubled ours.

[Aro]

Shiber, your plan could wait for... let's say, three or four turns? I mean, the other civs will have more cash. Three or four turns can allow someone to complete the research of those techs? If you see no problems, could be a good compromise and the American part of plan still doable. All plan, in fact.

[Thud]

This plan has my stamp of approval.

My only issue is that I was going to suggest waiting 3 turns, but would we then still get the worker? Perhaps, also, a civ might buy or discover these techs anyhow. Seems a risk we don't need to take.