Pre Poll Discussion: Structuring of the CoL

[Ninot]

i think 66.7+ would be better

but the rest is good.

[Will 5001]

Originally posted by Spiffor
How many time could we read "in the US, they do like this and like that" to justify a position ?

All the time

[Kramerman]

This nothing wrong justifying a claim like that. The US has been working fairly well now for like 225 years now. Few governments in history have lasted this long and continue to go strong. Though I agree people argue that with points that don't really apply to Apolytonia, being a direct democracy and havng a very different structure. I guess what Im trying to say is the US is'nt a bad model to look at.

[Will 5001]

There are many governments which have lasted longer, yet we dont draw from them. We are not a complete model of the US, but t is not a bad idea to get ideas from the US, but we musn't be a copy of the US.

[Epistax]

We're a democracy, the US is largely a republic. This is shown by: We poll people on plenty of things, where as the US polls elected officials. Technically US citizens only elect the Legislative branch, which convenes the electroral college to elect the Executive, who picks the Judicial branch.

</knowledge>

[Kramerman]

Originally posted by Epistax
We're a democracy, the US is largely a republic. This is shown by: We poll people on plenty of things, where as the US polls elected officials. Technically US citizens only elect the Legislative branch, which convenes the electroral college to elect the Executive, who picks the Judicial branch.

</knowledge>

Absolutely. I know this and have no qualms with this. I m just saying, is their really anything wrong with using the US as a basic model for certain things that apply?

There are many governments which have lasted longer, yet we dont draw from them. We are not a complete model of the US, but t is not a bad idea to get ideas from the US, but we musn't be a copy of the US.

There have definately been governments that have been around longer, like I said, but not MANY governments have lasted longer like you say. I hope you are not confused between what I mean of a government, and what is known as a culture. For example, France, as a culture is indeed many times older than the US. But its current government was established after wwII.

Thats beside the point. Epistax and Will, you make it sound like I said we need to base every aspect of our government on the US's, I did not. I said it wouldn't be a bad model to look at, meaning, in certain situations it could be beneficial to get ideas from it. I mean, we already have. The CoL is basically a Constituion, a written document made by the US forfathers to set the framework in which the government would work. Thats only one example.

Kman

P.S. I dunno if i was just misunderstood, or maybe I wrote my previous post poorly, but I clearly communictaed something other than what I meant to and sprked some needless 'micro-controversy.' I apologize.

[Spiffor]

Kramerman :
Actually, most institutions are indeed younger than the US (probably except Britain), but many governments in Europe have a different political culture from the US, with different yet interesting viws to make a democracy function.

For example, I see many Americans are diehard supporters of absolute freedom of speech, while some Europeans (myself and SirRalph possibly more) imagine limiting it. This comes mostly from the evolution of our political culture : the old censorship has evolved into some forbiddings in Europe. For example, in France, it is forbidden to "incicte to racial hate" : words can kill, so we forbid such words. In Germany, it is forbidden to create a "nazi party" and a "communist party" ; I think the latest version of the nazi party has been forbidden as well.

Democracies do not follow the same line, with the oldest being the most advanced on this line. There are differences among democracies, and we should either imagine something completely new (group method in polls), or take example from different countries, including the US but not exclusively. I think I'm not the only one who thinks a "this is done like that in the US" isn't an appealing argument. Probably, most US followers here will think the same if my motivation in an issue is "this is done like that in France". The only appealing argument IMO is "this is good for our democracy".
The US has good achievments, like other democracies, but should we take a model, Athens democracy should be ours, because we're a direct democracy with about 80 people, not 300 million.

[Will 5001]

I dont think that we should copy any one nation too much, and most European governments would have lasted longer were it not for World War 2. Although lots of people here are American, there are loads of non-americans, and I am sure that they don't want to be involved in a mini america (I don't !!!!)