What are the greatest civilizations of all time?

[siredgar]

Originally posted by Giovanni Wine
Ok... you convinced me:
Here is my ranking:

Top 10:

15. Korea (North and South): One of the oldest and most pacific civ in the world, thay have their own language and they are know one of the biggest exporter in the world. they have their own language, alphabet and culture, and now are one of the most scientificely (sp?) nation in the world (south only).

This is my top 15:
Still surprise me the exclusion of Arabs, Spain and Korea from the original Civ3!!!!

Saluti

Yay, Saluti! Thanks for including the Koreans on your list and especially recognizing the overall peaceful nature of their civilization. Civs should not be ranked solely on territorial conquest, enslavement of other peoples, and political domination. Cultural merit should be more important.

But you have to know that modern Korea pales in comparison to ancient Korea. It is really Korean civilization up to the 16th or 17th century that is notable. After that, the Koreans are pretty ashamed of their history, especially being subjugated to the Japanese who they long considered inferior.

One thing, however. How can you rank India and Russia ahead of England? After all the English conquered India and Russia was never as powerful or influential as England. We are communicating in English, right? Culturally, their civilization has also had a greater impact all over the world than the Indians or the Russians. They also started the Industrial Revolution!

[Dauphin]

Originally posted by siredgar
They also started the Industrial Revolution!

I would also point out that that was 50-100 years before the rest of the industrialised world. The first English factories being constructed well before the end of the 18th Century, whilst most others weren't industrialising until the mid 19th.

[jdjdjd]

Here's my Top Ten, if anyone cares....

1. China, just for the time they've been there, plus the cultural impact they've had in that region
2. India, another ancient with large impact
3. Ancient Rome, large cultural impact on Europe, and rest of area they controlled.
4. Ancient Greece, impact stretched to the Romans..and there's a reason will still study their writings today.
5. England, huge Empire, big world wide impact from many of their actions, whether wrong or right
6. Spanish...look how many people still speak their language
Now it gets tough
The French?
The US?
Germans?
Japanese?
Mongols?
Aztecs?
Albanians?... Albanians!? (just kidding)
Russians?
etc

7. Lets go with Japanese, another civ that has survived so many years, even though their Empire never stretched far for long, their culture has
8. Egyptians...another ancient civ stillstanding, and who dominated the world (as it was to them) for many years
9. Arabs, how many times did they stop the Crusaders? how long have they lived the way they have?
10. Aztecs...after all didn't they make chocolate

Another plug for the Italians, never a huge empire but huge impact culturally, religiously, commercially, philisophically, scirntifically, and huge player. (I mean people are talking about the Dutch, Portuguese, and Celts) Italians should be in top 20.

Too bad Firaxis couldn't give us a much larger group of Civs too choose from, how much space could it take?

[Jay Bee]

Albert Camus: "France, Italy and Spain form one same nation"


For the purposes of this thread, you may well replace 'nation' by 'civilization'.

[Giovanni Wine]

Originally posted by jdjdjd
Giovanni Wine,

Have you ever seen or put together an add to Civ, for Italians? hey could be scientific and commercial, Mussolini or Garibaldi as the leader, perhaps the fascist (brown shirt) as the special unit in Modern Era.

Let meknow if you know where I can find.

Thanks.

I remember one scenario for Civ2 called "Europe" where there were English, French, Germans, Austrians, Russian, Turkish and Italians.

The Italian leader was Giovanni Giolitti , one of our greatest statesman.... but i think that using King Vittorio Emanuele II the king that unified Italy would have been a better choice.
Mussolini would be another good choice if you want to create a "militaristic" Italy.

For Italy I see good 3 traits to choose from: Commercials (famous explorers and great trade cities like Venice and Genoa), Scientific (many great scientist), Religious (lots of Cathedrals, most of our art is raleted to religiuos stuff (the David for example) and many Popes).

Garibaldi I see him better as a great leader, not the leader.

You made me willing to start working on a mod that add Italy now.... Ok..... I'm going to work

Saluti



two minutes later:

[Giovanni Wine]

Originally posted by siredgar
One thing, however. How can you rank India and Russia ahead of England? After all the English conquered India and Russia was never as powerful or influential as England. We are communicating in English, right? Culturally, their civilization has also had a greater impact all over the world than the Indians or the Russians. They also started the Industrial Revolution!

Well....
to say the truth I was really fighting with myself on which of those three civs should have been the first one!

Here is what led me to the choice:

1) Years they exist (India 1, UK 2, Russia 3)
2) Population (India 1, Russia 2, UK 3)
3) Territory (Russia 1, India 2, UK 3)
4) Culture (India 1, UK 2, Russia 3)
5) Been a world power? (UK and Russia (as URSS)
6) Economy now (UK 1, Russia 2, India 3)

To say the truth I didn't thought of the industrial revolution, if I did probably I would have ranked the UK before Russia.
Anyway.... it is a matter of 1-2 points difference between the two nations!

Saluti

EDIT: I just decided that England should be ahead of China too, they deserve to be the first one.... and you know why?..... because they invented SOCCER

[Akka]

Originally posted by Giovanni Wine


Well....
to say the truth I was really fighting with myself on which of those three civs should have been the first one!

Here is what led me to the choice:

1) Years they exist (India 1, UK 2, Russia 3)
2) Population (India 1, Russia 2, UK 3)
3) Territory (Russia 1, India 2, UK 3)
4) Culture (India 1, UK 2, Russia 3)
5) Been a world power? (UK and Russia (as URSS)
6) Economy now (UK 1, Russia 2, India 3)

To say the truth I didn't thought of the industrial revolution, if I did probably I would have ranked the UK before Russia.
Anyway.... it is a matter of 1-2 points difference between the two nations!

Saluti

EDIT: I just decided that England should be ahead of China too, they deserve to be the first one.... and you know why?..... because they invented SOCCER

They invented FOOTBALL. SOCCER is an American invention because they were incapable of finding an appropriate word for their HANDMELON game.

Still amazed by how many people rank England so high.
England was the first to start its industrial revolution, and had a big colonial empire for 100 years.
Well, and so what ?
Small culture, few science, nearly zero philosophy, mythology...
If size of the civilization is so important, then Mongols should be first. What make a civ great is its culture and how it added to the humanity history. England, though very powerful during the second half of the 19th century, did not achieved much in this area.

[thinkingamer]

We are communicating in English, right?

Well, yes. We are communicating in English, but it was USA's influence that made English a world wide spoken language, not England.

[Ned]

Just my two cents:

The English, French, Germans, Austrians, Swiss, Spanish, Portuguese and Americans are ALL German/Roman nations. They all descend from the Germans who conquered the Roman Empire and who in turn (Franks) reconquered Germania. They were romanized by the Church. They share a common heritage and culture. They really are not separate "civilizations" even though they have become in modern times, separate nations.

I think the Scandinavians/Vikings are a separate civilization although I could understand how one would lump them with the Germans.

I think the Celts are a separate civilization.

I also think the Slavs are as well, with Russia the leading Slavic nation.

I see no mention of the Turks who dominated Central Asia and the ME for nearly 1000 years.

[Maelhavok]

Hello Civ III fans,

What is the greatest civ of all time? Subjective question.
I contend that the greatest is based in language, and around the world english is taught and spoken everywhere, irrespective of nationality. English speaking people share that culture. Yes if you are reading this you are part of this culture. My country(USA) The greater part of EU, UK and a great number of Asian/Mediterannean are hopelessly interrelated and impacted upon one another.
Which civilization? The New World Order. UU-Spin Doctors With the special ability to piss on your back and tell you its raining and to have (seemingly) everybody believe them, just look at thier polls.

Maelhavok

[jdjdjd]

Originally posted by Giovanni Wine


I remember one scenario for Civ2 called "Europe" where there were English, French, Germans, Austrians, Russian, Turkish and Italians.

The Italian leader was Giovanni Giolitti , one of our greatest statesman.... but i think that using King Vittorio Emanuele II the king that unified Italy would have been a better choice.
Mussolini would be another good choice if you want to create a "militaristic" Italy.

For Italy I see good 3 traits to choose from: Commercials (famous explorers and great trade cities like Venice and Genoa), Scientific (many great scientist), Religious (lots of Cathedrals, most of our art is raleted to religiuos stuff (the David for example) and many Popes).

Garibaldi I see him better as a great leader, not the leader.

You made me willing to start working on a mod that add Italy now.... Ok..... I'm going to work

Saluti



two minutes later:

King Vittorio Emanuele II it is...makes sense.
I will find that Europe mod, Thanks.
And godspeed on your creating the Italian's.

[thinkingamer]

[QUOTE]Which civilization? The New World Order. UU-Spin Doctors With the special ability to piss on your back and tell you its raining and to have (seemingly) everybody believe them, just look at thier polls[QUOTE]
Im sorry, but i did not understand this. Can u explain (or anyone) what u were trying to say? And what do u mean by New World Order

[Dauphin]

Originally posted by thinkingamer


Well, yes. We are communicating in English, but it was USA's influence that made English a world wide spoken language, not England.

That reeks of America-centrism. If the national language of the US was USAian (a distinctly different language to English), English would still be the number one language. Of course America has furthered this to greater heights in the mass media age.

Consider the number of countries that speak English, that has nothing to do with America and you will see what I mean:

Australasia, half of Africa, the Indian sub-continent and the whole of North America. How much more global do you want?

[thinkingamer]

Dear Sagacious Dolphin, i while ur statements are true, i believe that the rest of the world speaks American English not British English.
Just imagine if America Speaks French instead of English: Only Australasia, half of Africa, the Indian sub-continent would speak English, and the rest of the world would speack French.

[Dauphin]

and the rest of the world would speack French

No it wouldn't.