Announcement

**Bad Ax** · December 19, 2001, 12:45

Poles:
I might be off my rocker here, but shouldn't Lech Walesa be included as a leader? Have I somehow just associated him with the wrong country?

I seem to recall also that Hussars are properly Hungarian units, but that's a minor issue by all accounts. I think they ought to replace knights at 4/2/3, requiring horses but not iron. This would fit their typical role as highly mobile shock troops and scouts. I could, however, be stupid on this point

I think shunned/favored here is right on... probably to everyone's relief...

Don't really know enough about the other civs in this list to make a contribution.

**Wernazuma III** · December 19, 2001, 13:18

Bad Ax: The Hussar has been voted for on LoD's homepage as the Polish UU by polish people, so I guess they're right. 4/2/3 is a good option, I'll add it to the list. LoD did not add Walesa as a leader, but you're right about the country. I'd have added him anyway, I just didn't give a second look on LoD's list.

**Rosacrux** · December 22, 2001, 00:05

Just a general remark, those civs are not my strong point so I wouldn't be able to really tell about UUs. Just that I think not even one of the extrapack civs has communist as a favored gov and most actually have it as shunned.

I think that's against game balance AND historical accuracy in some occasions (like Khmer - I mean what the west knows is mainly the Khmer Rouge and that should allow you to give them the "fav. communist".

Dunno, just some thoughts.

Otherwise keep on the great work!

**Wernazuma III** · December 22, 2001, 02:53

Rosacrux: While I agree that not having Communism favored civs (except Inca) can well be a matter of dispute, I think it even adds to game-balance, because AI civs are even likely to become Communist, once at war, even when its "shunned". I had AI-American Communism in every single game so far.

For the Khmer: We thought more on the medieval Khmer, but still I kindalike the idea to make them favor Communism, at least they are a candidate.

**datakodin** · December 22, 2001, 05:14

Re: Extra Pack Finalization Project (part 4)

Originally posted by Wernazuma III
Poles
Cities:
Szczecin
Gdansk

Szczecin = Stettin (Germany)
Gdansk = Danzig (Germany)

Be logical! If Stettin and Danzig are in the list of Polish cities - why do you forget to include Berlin also?

**Wernazuma III** · December 22, 2001, 05:44

Re: Extra Pack Finalization Project (part 4)

Of course that will be removed.

I've noticed that Stettin is in, didn't see Gdansk, otherwise it wouldn't have remained in the list so long! Why did no one else notice? I really have to start to take a look on things I post...

**datakodin** · December 22, 2001, 08:28

Re: Re: Extra Pack Finalization Project (part 4)

Originally posted by Wernazuma III
I really have to start to take a look on things I post...

Yes, you have

Wroclaw = Breslau (guess who

)

BTW your city list for Poland seems to be really unsorted. Is it important or not? I mean Krakow is better to be Polish city #2.

**LoD** · December 22, 2001, 12:18

Wernazuma: Are you nuts

? Removing cities from the list just because they have German names? So, what's next, Warschau?

**Wernazuma III** · December 22, 2001, 13:59

LoD: AFAIK, Stettin/Sczcecin was a city of german culture and language from its founding. Breslau/Wroclaw also. I'm not really sure for Gdansk/Danzig though, although the city was german for some time, I guess it has had more polish origins and history than I believed, maybe you can enlighten me...

**Wernazuma III** · December 22, 2001, 14:09

About sorting the city list: Could you do that LoD? I'd say we keep Gdansk in the list but remove Sczcecin and Wroclaw, but I have little knowledge. And after all "Königsberg" also has not been added to the russian city list...

Some data I could get about Wroclaw: Breslau had originally slavic origins. In the 12th/13th cent. the city was inhabited by german settlers. During the bohemian reign (1335-1526), the city had mixed german/polish/czech population. Under austrian rule, the city was heavily "germanized", even more so under prussian rule (since 1763), when Breslau became the second most important prussian city. In 1918, the german-polish population ratio was about 30:1
After WWII, when most of the german population has been expelled, the communists encouraged polish people from Lwow, which became an ucrainian city, to settle in Wroclaw. Thus, today's Wroclaw has aspects from both cities, Breslau and Lwow. (Freely translated from http://www.urlaub-polen.de/breslau.shtml )

If this is no complete bull****, that would make Breslau qualify rather as being a german city.

**Wernazuma III** · December 22, 2001, 14:32

Stettin/Sczcecin: 8th cent: Founding of slavic settlement; 12th cent. german influence gets stronger in the region; 1278: Stettin becomes member of the Hanse. Until the 17th cent. Stettin (whole Pommeria) was ruled by polish aristocracy. Then the city became swedish. 1720: Prussia takes over the city.
In 1945, several 10k Germans had to leave Stettin, polish administration takes control over Stettin, under heavy protest of western diplomats.
I didn't look very deep, whether the city has more german or polish character or population in the long run. Only the one info from the situation in 1945.

**Optimizer** · December 22, 2001, 15:09

I think the Hussars should replace Cavalry instead of Knights, for instance being 6/3/4. There are already too many knight-type unique units.

**Wernazuma III** · December 22, 2001, 15:49

I've also thought about making the Hussar a replacement for the Cavalry. Your choice would be too strong however (2 bonuses, actually a faster Cossack). 4 movement is exagerated anyway, so the only remaining option would be 7/2/3

**Optimizer** · December 22, 2001, 19:10

Cavalry is 6/3/3, isn't it?

Maybe the Hussars could have extended vision range instead.

Announcement

Extra Pack Finalization Project (part 4)

Extra Pack Finalization Project (part 4)

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