Extra Pack Finalization Project (part 4)

[LoD]

All of the three cities were in the original territory of Poland to begin with. It is true that all have had a multicultural influence upon them, but keep in mind that the Poland was very multicultural in the past. The only city that I am willing to allow to drop from the list is Sczecin, since I agree it hasn't been actually within the borders of Poland for a very long period of time ('though as said before, it was there when the state was coming to existence). But Gdansk and Wroclaw must stay. BTW, I wonder where you got that info about the latter - for one thing, it was never in Austrian territory.

[Wernazuma III]

You mean Wroclaw? All Silesia was Austrian from 1526 to 1742. Well, legally, it was bohemian, but under habsburg rule. Maria Theresia has to give it up to Prussia in the Austrian succession war.Btw, AFAIK Silesia was polish in the beginning (let's say 9th cent.), then became part of the Holy Roman Empire since 1327 and did not become polish again before 1945.
If you'd ask me, Wroclaw/Breslau is even the most german city of the three.
I agree on the multicultural aspect of the polish though. Please believe me that I'm not a "greater germany" supporter.
One option though could be to have the cities in both lists with german and polish names (we have this case often regarding ancient civs, so why not in here too?). Just a thought...

[lockstep]

Originally posted by LoD
But Gdansk and Wroclaw must stay. BTW, I wonder where you got that info about the latter - for one thing, it was never in Austrian territory.

Actually, Breslau/Wroclaw was Austrian from 1526 (when Ferdinand of Habsburg was elected king of Bohemia, of which Silesia was a part then) to 1742 (when Austria had to cede Silesia to Prussia).

[datakodin]

Originally posted by Wernazuma III
And after all "Königsberg" also has not been added to the russian city list...

Ja, ja, naturlich... Because "Königsberg" is, in fact, Krolewiec ("King-city") and it was named after one Chech King and belonged to Luzhica Serbs who are living in Germany now and are demanding to be independent country

Check this and enjoy by "real" names of some German cities.
What about Slubice-n-Odra, which is illegally renamed by those evil Germans into Frankfurt?
http://luzicane.boom.ru/luzica.html

Seriously, why not to have a poll for Stettin/Szczecin, Danzig/Gdansk and Breslau/Wroclaw? It is Apolyton Extra Pack only, not decision of UN, OTAN or any other world-wide organization.

[Wernazuma III]

datakodin: maybe you should add that you're talking about Frankfurt/ Oder and not Frankfurt/ Main...

I know quite well that many german cities grew upon slavic settlements. My beautiful hometown itself, Graz was once a small village around a slovene "gradec" or "little castle"... Same goes for the majority of towns/cities in Styria. Nevertheless Graz is an austrian city, not only politically but also from population since almost thousand years...

I really like the idea of putting the german/polish cities in both lists, thus no one really gets hurt.

[Q Classic]

wernazuma, et. al.: the city list for the korean civ has been updated at the following address:

http://apolyton.net/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=38340

[LoD]

Wernazuma: I am positive that Wroclaw lied more time within Polish borders in Prussia/Germany - especially more than Szczecin. I can drag some people here with arguments on the case if you wish .
Overall, I agree to your proposal to duplicate cities with different names in the two city lists.

datakodin: But there are two cities now - Frankfurt am Oder and Slubice .

Q Cubed: Wait a moment - are you the Q Cubed? The same one as the guy from alpha.owo?

[Q Classic]

LoD:

well, i've never been referred to as the Q Cubed, but yah, it's me from alpha.owo.

that's a lot to be said for keeping the same handle for what, several years now.

i'm also the same Q Cubed as the one that was at SidGames, ACOL, and numerous others.

[burak]

What's going on? Last post that I see is

LoD:

well, i've never been referred to as the Q Cubed, but yah, it's me from alpha.owo.

that's a lot to be said for keeping the same handle for what, several years now.

i'm also the same Q Cubed as the one that was at SidGames, ACOL, and numerous others.

And there's none link to second page of this forum.

If sb reply me, I'm not sure if I'll see it.

[siredgar]

You can omit "shi" from all the Korean cities. It just means "city" and Koreans don't really use the term like that. Also, you will need more historical cities, too, like:

Hanyang (present-day Seoul, so may be repetitive like Edo with Tokyo for Japan)

Sabi

Namyang

Soanpyong

Koryong

Ungjin

Anyhow, there was only one "daewang" (great king) and that was King Sejong. All other Korean kings were just called "wang" (king).

Also, I'm opposed to using non-English words like "kobukson" or "daewang" instead of "turtleboat" or "king". After all, Rome is called "Rome" not "Roma". So, the same goes for all the other proposed civs. Simply, this game is in English and all terms should be translated to English.

Also, the favored government of monarchy is fine, but republic may be a better choice. While Korea was a monarchy for a very long time, it is now a democracy (just like England or France). In fact, it is often considered the only true democracy in Asia right now. Most Koreans don't like the idea of royalty in modern society anyhow. The English are more appreciative of their monarchy than the Koreans are, for example.

[LoD]

burak: Lost during the forum transfer.
Rewriting what's still relevant:
Q-Cubed: Well, there's always the first time . I was extremely suprised when I saw your nick here BTW... I thought you dissapeared from the scene (but then again, I wasn't much of Pollytubby ).
-------------------------
Wernazuma III: Alright, explain this to me . You said you had to trim down the list of cities that I've sent you (for Poland), because of their number. Now, why do Poles have 63, the Ethopians have 71, and Koreans - 91? I confess I know very little about history of Eastern Asia, but simple logic tells me that the Koreans, even in their greatest time, were a little limited by the Chineese in terms of territory to grow the size of, for example, XVIth-century Poland. Now, is it just me, or is there something weird about that ?

[Wernazuma III]

Nope, I guess the list is OK as it is

[Q Classic]

the 91 cities, i suppose you can drop the last 20 to put them on par with the ethiopians.

most of them are smaller cities anyway, with little to do in the way of history.

and if you so wish, you can drop -shi, as siredgar is right, it just means "city". i personally, however, would like to see that stay~ it's just a personal preference here, so.

same with using kobukson/turtle ship and wang(daewang)/king(...the great). you can change them if need be, but i'd prefer to have them rendered in romanized korean.
besides, the zulus have their "impi" unit, which, as far as i can tell, isn't exactly an english term, so the precedent has already been set.

to add to the ancient names for cities, you could also add seowon-shi, or seowon if you prefer.

-----
well, lod: i did disappear from the scene, actually, for a while. i hadn't enjoyed apton so much, and so didn't make the switch when firaxis died, even though i'd been registered back when owo was around. even now, i'm not a frequent viewer, or poster, so...

[Wernazuma III]

I agree with you about keeping the Kobukson and Wang, but I tend to remove the -shi thing, because it comes with almost every city name and that is somehow ennervating if you ask me.

[siredgar]

At one point, the Koreans controlled most of Manchuria and parts of Siberia. That's about the same amount of territory as all of Western Europe. Do they deserve more cities than the Polish? Probably not, but they did control a lot of land for a longer period of time. In fact, the Koreans had sovereignty over the same territory for at least 1,000 years, uninterrupted. That's pretty impressive.