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Apolyton ExtraCivs Pack: Arab Unique Unit

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  • Apolyton ExtraCivs Pack: Arab Unique Unit

    As explained in the main discussion thread, we should decide on some of the Unique Units for the Apolyton ExtraCivs Pack ASAP so the graphics people can start working when they're ready. So that's what this thread is about: deciding what the Unique Unit of the Arabs should be. I think I picked the most logical choices but feel free to post alternatives (if 'Other' becomes very popular we could have a 'second round').

    For each civ I added a very brief description to give an impresssion of the importance of each unit. Note that I had to make 20 odd descriptions for 5 threads so I didn't bother doing extensive research or anything, 95% of the info is from the top of my head. So it's quite possible I made some mistakes or left out vital information or whatever. I very much encourage others with more knowlegde and time to post more elaborate explanations and/or point out my mistakes (some pictures could be useful as well, esp. for the graphics people).



    Explanations:
    The Dervishes were extremely religious people from Sudan. They were also excellent warriors and fought on horseback, camelback or foot (but the cavalrymen are most famous). They opposed any kind of penetration of European powers in the Arab world or Africa and fought these penetrations fanatically.

    The Xebec and the Dhow were the naval vessels that formed the basis of the Arab fleet. The Saracens were good navigators and the Xebec formed the basis for their extensive sea-trade network (though probably not as extensive as their land-trade network).

    The Mameluke were North African troops that were used by the Arabs to fight the Mongol and Turkic invasion forces. They were fierce and experienced warriors and the Mamelukes were one of the few armies to actually defeat the Mongols in combat. Like the Mongols, the majority of the Mameluke forces were cavalry (but in AoK a Camel unit was used to represent them).

    Camels were used frequently by the Arabs in combat. They were fast and light but could be well armoured and were thus excellent units for raiding.
    148
    Reuse (and possibly rename) the Rider and give the Chinese a different unit (see other thread)
    1.35%
    2
    Dervish
    17.57%
    26
    Xebec/Dhow
    4.05%
    6
    Mameluke (Cavalry)
    14.19%
    21
    Mameluke (Camelry)
    29.73%
    44
    Camel Raider
    22.30%
    33
    Other
    6.08%
    9
    Don't know/Don't care
    4.73%
    7
    Administrator of WePlayCiv -- Civ5 Info Centre | Forum | Gallery

  • #2
    Would a UU called Terrorist be out of line? It could be a modern era unit 16/1/1.

    Comment


    • #3
      Camel Raider, we don't want to make this an AoE: AoK rip off...

      Replaces Knight...4.2.2?
      "Chegitz, still angry about the fall of the Soviet Union in 1991?
      You provide no source. You PROVIDE NOTHING! And yet you want to destroy capitalism.. you criminal..." - Fez

      "I was hoping for a Communist utopia that would last forever." - Imran Siddiqui

      Comment


      • #4
        Would a UU called Terrorist be out of line? It could be a modern era unit 16/1/1.
        Yes, and then we could make a new one for the Americans and call it "Bush" and give it 1/16/1 just to make it interesting, or maybe that would be unfair considering defense bonuses

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by SofaKing
          Would a UU called Terrorist be out of line? It could be a modern era unit 16/1/1.
          NOT amusing at all asshole
          "Chegitz, still angry about the fall of the Soviet Union in 1991?
          You provide no source. You PROVIDE NOTHING! And yet you want to destroy capitalism.. you criminal..." - Fez

          "I was hoping for a Communist utopia that would last forever." - Imran Siddiqui

          Comment


          • #6
            suicide bomber.

            Comment


            • #7
              you are a moron.
              "Chegitz, still angry about the fall of the Soviet Union in 1991?
              You provide no source. You PROVIDE NOTHING! And yet you want to destroy capitalism.. you criminal..." - Fez

              "I was hoping for a Communist utopia that would last forever." - Imran Siddiqui

              Comment


              • #8
                Something else

                First of all, no need to make snide and insulting comments about other civs (why do you play the game?) Keep this sort of stupid things to yourself and out of our forum

                I don't think any of the units offered makes much sense. Mamlukes are good, but that would place the Arab golden Age in the late Middle Ages while their Golden Age was in the Early middle ages- I would ask for those that Know what the early Arab armies or those of the Caliphate of Bagdhad were composed of mainly?
                If you don't like reality, change it! me
                "Oh no! I am bested!" Drake
                "it is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong" Voltaire
                "Patriotism is a pernecious, psychopathic form of idiocy" George Bernard Shaw

                Comment


                • #9
                  It's gotta be the camel, they took over all of Northern Africa and Spain with them...wasn't until Tours that they were really stopped. Definitely early middle age golden age, definitely the Camel
                  "Chegitz, still angry about the fall of the Soviet Union in 1991?
                  You provide no source. You PROVIDE NOTHING! And yet you want to destroy capitalism.. you criminal..." - Fez

                  "I was hoping for a Communist utopia that would last forever." - Imran Siddiqui

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    from the clancy novels i read i get the feeling the ancient arabs were big on getting on a horse and chasing another guy on a horse with a big sword.

                    that's more or less what he said was their "legacy" (fighting wise)



                    he was talking about how it's hard to get them to work as a modern cavalry(sp?) unit because they have a loner warrior tradition
                    Prince of...... the Civ Mac Forum

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by orange
                      It's gotta be the camel, they took over all of Northern Africa and Spain with them...wasn't until Tours that they were really stopped. Definitely early middle age golden age, definitely the Camel
                      Arabs were consumate Light Horsemen, they were known for their *fast* horses ... those are what were the bulk of the cavalry arms of their Armies .... Camels, in addition to being unruly beasts, are uselss in actual combat and the terrain in North Africa and Spain would favor Horses over Camelry. Can someone point me to a source quoting the extensive use of Camels in Medieval Arabian warfare ... ? (I grew up there and was exposed to their history ... so ...)

                      Suggest Light Horseunit with +1 move, +1 def (due to speed\maneuver).

                      Dervishes are more religious than cultural UU - not a good idea in any circumstance (that would be like having a Crusader unit for the English).

                      Mamelukes would be a second vote, but they're nothing more special than swordsmen IMO ...

                      be0wulfe

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        The armies of the Jihad:

                        Vive la liberte. Noor Inayat Khan, Dachau.

                        ...patriotism is not enough. I must have no hatred or bitterness towards anyone. Edith Cavell, 1915

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          I stand corrected then ... interesting what you're taught, guess we got the romanticized version.

                          Still say camels are foul beasts.

                          Even if they can do complex math in their heads

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Whatever the Arab UU is, it should have +1 movement. During the Crusades and early expansion, speed and hit-and-run raids were the only advantage the soldiers had (except for Fanatacism but the Europeans/Crusaders had that too). I think it should replace the horsemen personally because replacing the Knight would make it too strong.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              If it's a camel unit, I want it to get att/def bonuses when fighting in a desert square.

                              A small correction to description of Mamelukes - they had a Sultanate based in Egypt for some time, but they were mostly Cuman/Kipchak, Circassian or other Caucasian slave warriors, not North African. Baybars al-Bunduqdari, one of the most famous Mameluke Sultans whom I suggested as a great leader, was Kipchak.

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